I Shouldn't Have Knocked Back! | Western Maryland

0:00 Welcome to Big for Society. If you have Bigfoot activity to report from the same areas discussed in this episode, please reach out to me directly after this episode. And if you'd like to be on the podcast to discuss a personal Bigfoot encounter, please reach out to me directly at Big for Society at gmail dot com. Do you wish there was more Big for Society to listen to you every week? Well there is now. If you become a supporting member over at Patreon, you get a special members only episode every single week on Wednesdays, and sometimes even more episodes. Head on over to patreon dot com. Forward slash the Big for Society and now let's get on with the show. All right, Big for Society. You've got the privilege of talking to Dustin today. Dustin is an individual that reached out to me actually through a voicemail, who wanted to share some things he's experienced over the years in Western Maryland, which is an area we don't hear a lot from. So it's a privileged to have you on the show today. Dustin, how's it going.

1:01 Good? Going good? Thanks for having me. Absolutely I was, Yeah, I was worn down in a place called Grantsville in western Maryland, and it's like it's five minutes from PA, about ten minutes from West Virginia and really close to Forbes State Forest, which is the video I saw that got me intrigued to preach out. Fantastic. I remember when you reached out and how you'd mentioned that I believe in the voicemail, and I was like immediately, it was like, yeah, we definitely got to have a conversation because the things that were coming out of Forbes State Forest. And I know I've talked to other people since then, researchers in the state that have had things happen in that area as well. So you know, I'm excited to hear what you have to share today, Dustin.

1:51 So I'm going to go ahead, and you know, hand things right over two years. Feel free to take us back to when things started to occur to your guarding a big foot and in that area. All right, So this starts in October of two thousand and four. This was my first encounter, me and the one friend. We were camping up in private property on my family's farm. And this is really thick, like this is second growth old trees. It hasn't been logged back then, and we had this old jeep, this old Willie's jeep, and this thing was loud. So we're driving up through the woods and I have this cooler on the back of the jeep that I jackson whiskey from my dad's basement, thinking we'd be cool kids at like age fourteen, and the cooler fell out of the jeep. I ran over the cooler and my Dad's taken up behind us, so I freak out and dumped the whiskey out. This gets relevant later, but anyway, we get up there, we cut a bunch of firewood, and we're saving a good time being boising in the woods. And then we got a pretty good fire going, and like round ten pm, i'd say something starts like beating on a tree. It sounds like and to me, I grew up in the woods, avid outdoors, in the whole life and stuff. So I'm thinking, what is this. I never heard this before. Like it

3:23 was loud and it was like starting to shake the ground kind of. I kept thinking, is it a turkey like trying to get up and it's a rooster or something. I don't know what this is. My buddy, he has no idea he's just looking at me sort of worke at this point, and whatever this was, it just keeps getting closer and closer and louder, And this knocking noise is like getting bigger. It's starting to like kind of shake the grounds. It feels like something's taking a part of a tree, not a limb, but like part of a tree and beating another tree. So and me, I get the axe and I start beating a tree back.

4:04 I knocked back. Well, that must have been a mistake, because then it got really close and really loud, started making like the hair stand up on the back of our necks. We were just in total terror because we had no clue because at this point we really were fourteen. We didn't really believe in Bigfoot. We didn't know what bigfoot was. We threw all the fire wood we had on the fire it surprise didn't burn the woods down, and we just hopped in that jeep and drove out of the woods, went over to my uncle's house and we slept in the jeep that night, and the next morning we went back up in the woods and started looking around to try to figure out what that thing was.

4:51 There was no signs of anything but that's back in my amateur photography days and when I was first starting to take pictures. So I just started taking pictures on my thirty five millimeter camera of like just the woods and everything. I have like all these random pictures. And I started going through these pictures this past winter and I found a bunch of them that have these really weird looking orbs. These orbs look like the Snapchat ghost symbol. I mean too a T looks like the Snapchat symbol, like the white ghost. And they're white too. But they're all in different places. They're all different pictures, different locations in the woods, but they're all very similar in different parts of the picture. So it's not like a glitch on the camera. And this one, I just looked at it the end of today. It's moving. The picture itself is still like it's in focus, but this orb is like moving up. It has a tail, so I don't know what that's all about. The that's some pretty wild stuff too. There was no scent. I didn't smell anything.

6:04 It was it was quiet that night. It was really quiet. And that's about it for that one. It's scared to crap out of us and rans out of the woods and my buddy he went mia on. He doesn't want to talk about it, and he sort of fell off the map. But then I had another encounter, and this is way later. This is November twenty three, twenty eighteen, at five point fifty eight pm. I actually had the exact time because I was taking pictures of the noon over in a place called Springs, PA. And I was sitting at a crossroads next to a cornfield, and on the other side of the cornfield was an Amish schoolhouse and it was a full moon that night, and I'm sitting there in my truck just I took two pictures of the noon and after I took the second one, I heard this roar. Something let out this roar right behind me, and it was a blood curling scream, and it was the most high pitched, long drawn out scream I've ever heard in my life. I thought an Amish lady was getting murdered. To be honest, I had no idea what that could have been. But I found the video on TikTok that is exactly what I heard. Mom,

7:37 was a little bit more high pitched than this, So I'm gonna play it now for you than I think it's time to go. So, yeah, that's what I heard right behind my truck. It shook me. It shook my truck, and I just sort of drove off slowly and I started thinking, okay, logic, brain kicking, what was that? And I was like, I've had a couple of mountain lion encounters, which they're not supposedly around here either, but I have prefailure too. But I started looking up mountain lion screams and Bobcat screams and nothing is even remotely close to that rule that was. That was absolutely wild, and to this day I still have no idea what either of them where. I didn't have a visual. But that's that's my two encounters pretty much.

8:49 That's that's fascinating stuff. And you know that's the area that, like I said before, we don't hear a lot about. The first thing I got to ask right after bat is did anything happen to the whiskey? Yeah, I dumped it out like my dad was like following us up through the woods and I dumped it out, and oh, yeah, sorry for talk about that. Yeah, I could only imagine if we would have had that up in the woods, and like we would have got drunk at fourteen and then that happened. I couldn't imagine what the outcome would have been. We that could have been a different scenario completely. Yeah, that would have been oh man. Either you would have gone out of your minds with fear or you would have become like super macho dudes and really gotten in trouble, you know, and tried to fight the big foot or something. And who knows, right, but there could have been a different story for sure. When you heard that roar, did that affect you physically in any way?

9:55 It shook me. It made my ears ring kind, but it didn't like hurt me per se or anything. Just scared me. I guess interesting this area or the region where you had these things happen. Have you heard of other people having encounters in this area as well? Not really personally, but if you go on Google, I think it's gone now, But if you go on Google and type in pa Bigfoot legend, it used to come up on Google Maps with all these like pin drops of people putting their encounters in the location of it, and it was really cool. And there's in Pennsylvania alone, there's like there's thousands of these just in Pennsylvania all around this area too, I mean, like ten minutes from my house here. There's been encounters documented on there.

10:55 Absolutely. I mean it's Pennsylvania for some reason, you know a lot of it just it just has a ton of bigfoot activity. Maryland has some weird stuff too, I mean not just Bigfoot, it also has things such as I mean, if you're thinking about other cryptids, you've got dog Man stuff happens in Maryland a lot. I think it's also called the Dueyo. Oh, yeah, that's Beggar's Down. Had a couple of encounters of that. Us all so funny about dog Man. My girlfriend and I we actually she lets close to an Indian burial ground up in Farmings in ta and her mom had an encounter years ago walking next to the cemetery.

11:41 She says, this coyote walked in front of her, but it had like a hyena face and it smile at her. And I was like, well, from everything I've heard, that does not sound like a regular coyote to me. So so we go out and we go hunting for him too sometimes, but we haven't found anything yet. I don't know if I really want to find him. Yeah, that brings up a good point. So after you had these encounters, how did this affect the rest of your life as it pertains to Bigfoot and other things like that. Well, here's where stuff can get crazy for me, all right.

12:24 So I have a pretty big spiritual stance with the Bigfoot thing. I think he is a spiritual being and can shape shift and all this, which in twenty fourteen, I had a crazy, crazy near death experience to where I actually I flatlined. It's clinkly dead for two minutes and I was gonna they put me in a coma and all this stuff, and it changed my life, completely changed my views on everything, and it really opened my eyes to the whole big foot thing, and like, let me down the rabbit hole love this to figure out more and more. And that's all I'm doing, is just trying to put it together to make sense of it for me. And I also think that there's ties to UFOs absolutely. So I have a crazy UFO encounter as well from two thousand and eight next to an old mine which bigfoots and Indo coome from minds. Me and my buddy were down at this fire. We were getting ready to do some drinking back in the day there and we didn't. We just have her fire going, and this flying saucer, I mean to a tea what you would call a flying saucer just glided right over top of us. Had a couple of different rays of led lights.

13:38 I want to get two into that. But it was absolutely crazy. And then I pulled my grandma about that, and she said, back in the sixties on the same property where my first encounter happened, she said, exactly what I saw flew over their building, which is over the property where that happened, between the orbs and the UFOs. And I have no idea. It's all wild. That's so interesting. And these areas that you've been mentioning, how far away from like Chestnut Ridge area, Pennsylvania would that be?

14:19 Just the ridge that's I think that's about an hour maybe two hours on the I as some friends that ATV riding up there and stuff. Okay, cool. I just know that, like the southwest corner of is is very well known throughout history for bigfoot slash UFO sightings and encounters. For some reason, that corner of the state is very wild when it comes to that. So have you been actively trying to to search out Bigfoot in different ways.

15:02 Not consistently, but like I said, me and my girlfriend we like to go out and get adventuring at night and just sort of see what we can find. In my experience, if you get looking for you're not going to find it. But if you don't get looking forward to'll find you. So that's sort of how all this happened with me. I guess how we go about it. Big for society will be right back after these messages. You know, I.

15:42 Totally agree with you. My own research experience is very very little, or I would say very limited so far, really just a few years, And I will agree with you that if I take the times where I actually gone out and you know, knocked on trees and done all those things that you see on TV. And then the other times when we're just sitting around in camp and having a good time, and maybe it's in an area where it's known for bigfoot activity, I'm just hanging out being a camper. Those times usually you're going to have way more things start to happen. But what have you found are the ways that you and your girlfriend usually end up doing that trying to find Bigfoot without actually you know, I guess knocking on trees or things like that.

16:43 We just sort of go and like find creepy old places. Like a couple of weeks ago we went and found the sold covered bridge and there's like this big sign about witch casting spells and just a bunch of old, creepy energy sort of. So we just go and find I don't know, eerie and odd places and stuff and just sort of hike around at dark and see what happens. Don't really put our minds to it, and just let be per se. But we haven't had an encounter together yet. Who knows what will happened. Have you ever had anything weird happen when you're out there looking around at different places?

17:30 A few times, way back in the day, we used to go up to Forbes at night and partying and stuff and driving around up there, and we used to encounter plans of Amish, Like four or five Amish guys would be out at I don't know, four, three four in the morning. They all had shotguns and like they're just walking down the road, but they're out three four in the morning with shotguns. So that's kind of strange, all right, Okay, So I mean they could be. Yeah, here's what they're going after. So everyone listening. If you're going out to Forbes State Forest, I guess you have to be aware of rogue amish, I don't know, hunting in the middle of the night with shotguns, guys, I would be careful if if you're going looking out for bigfoot out there. So you're saying the one bridge that you went over, it actually had a sign that had like different different symbols and how to cast things.

18:32 Yeah, yeah, it's called the Hexburger. Okay, Hechburger. It's on my TikTok If anyone wants to look at that, it's I have the video of it on my TikTok. It's a pretty cool sign. That's pretty cool place. It's called the Hexy Witch. That's what it is, the Hexi Witch, and that's in Somerset County close to on the Centerville, Pennsylvania. Do you still have TikTok on your phone? I do. Don't. Don't delete the app, do you know why? Because they tell us no, it's it's out of the app store.

19:14 So if you get rid of it for some reason, then you can't get it back. Right, I'm gonna definitely. Fun to the side thing there. So it sounds like you, It sounds like you have a pretty unique way of looking at bigfoot, as you mentioned before. Yeah, I think, like I believe, we're spiritual beings having a human experience, and we everybody has the power to ultimately change what they perceive, what they feel their own reality. So like, if you change your mindset and you change your vibration, you will actually attract different things into your life.

19:59 From what I've found, and this all stems back to my crazy near death experience and stuff. And and for all the people that like don't believe in bigfoot and stuff, it's because they're they're blocking that out automatically by thinking it's not real. Well, if you think that thoughts are words become reality, ultimately what you say will unfold whatever you believe either. Way, that's interesting. So I want to make I want to make sure I'm on the right path with you here, so that the more that I am thinking slash believing in Bigfoot, maybe the more chance that I have of you know, seeing one or having any encounter one one day.

20:52 Is that is that the right way of thinking about it? Or Yeah? Absolutely, I think if you're if you're open to the experience, you will have a chance at it. Like I said, that wouldn't go like searching specifically, But be open to it. Don't close it off. If you want to have an encounter, be open to it, and then just sort of forget about it and just have fun in the woods. Get to some crazy remote places and see what happens. Like I get I can by myself all the time that I go off the trail I gave these places I probably shouldn't go by myself. And I always have this presence around me sometimes, but I've I guess I've been blessed and lucky. You've never been been taken up or anything.

21:37 Now when you say a presence around you, can you explain a little bit more what that exactly means. I'm interested in that. Yeah, So I'm what you would call an mpath. I pick up on other people's energy. I'm extremely sensitive to energy, and like my intuition is just really really good. So let's they were on my private property there. Ever, since all this happened, every time I go up in those woods, I feel a presence. I feel like I'm almost being watched, you know what I mean. Like something's just a little bit off. Like for example, this summer, I was up and there clearing some trails out and I was right by the camping spot there where the first encounter happened, and I was doing some weed whack and getting ready to build a cabin. And it's so thick with rhododendron and fine trees, somewhat treesy you can't walk through it.

22:40 But I'm out in this clearing, I keep hearing something that sounded bipedal walking through this thick stuff. Like, I know, it's not a bear. I know I've had a million encounters with bears. It was not a bear. So I had my weed whackers, so I'd rather the engine up for all out and you know, running around the little bit because I'm like, oh boy, here we get and it would stop, turn a weed whacker off, and it would keep walking like back and forth. I'm like, it's not a deer. It would have jumped the bush and ran. It's not a bear. I know. Bears they don't walk on two feet in this crunch crunch, crunch, crunch, So it's a sassot them built my cabin. But yeah, it's energy's crazy when you actually start getting into it from everything I've encountered my personal experiences, and it's just absolutely wild.

23:40 Oh absolutely. Do you ever experience like times in that area when the things just get like extremely dead quiet out of nowhere? Oh yeah, okay, oh yeah you get that. Yeah mm hmm. Any any noises that that really don't fit the area at all that are just extremely out of place? Well, besides like the roars and stuff there. One night this past summer, and my girlfriend and I were sitting on my pe chair in Maryland, and there's lots of packs of coyotes all around us, and sometimes they'll all go crazy into a frenzy, and you know that that sounds like something's being murdered itself. But the first howl was not a coyote like yip or a bark. This was like a very big how, like a huge dog howl, And then stuff just got dead quiet, like that dog, the big dog thing how growled whatever. The coyotes went crazy for like two minutes, and then it just got totally totally silent. So I don't know if that was a dog man or because I've heard they run with coyotes.

24:59 I've heard some crazy stories about this too as well. Oh absolutely, I mean there's been I also have heard and gotten some interesting accounts about Bigfoot in coyote interaction. Sometimes it's like the Bigfoot have the coyotes as some kind of pet, or maybe there's like a symbiotic relationship happening, or sometimes the coyotes just get totally messed up by the Bigfoot. You mean, I guess it depends on what kind of day they're having. Who knows. But you know, you've got some really interesting viewpoints when it comes to Bigfoot. But how do you How would you describe what Bigfoot is?

25:44 I'm curious about that. Hmm. I would say he's I'd say he's a protector of this earth in some way or another. I'm it's kind of getting away far out there and with all like the UFO nuclear power plant like stops for like, like I said, the bomb off and all of a sudden, the spaceship comes and stops it. It could be a big Foot in there, But I think he's an extra dimensional being that, like I said, can absolutely shape shift, can absolutely change forms. But you have to be open to that stuff to believe that stuff. Like I said, I'm spiritual guru weirdo. So I'm out there and then like I like, I've been a photographer my whole life, and I've besides these pictures here. I've always picked up this insane orb play on my all my photos throughout the years. I have a couple that look like I got a demonic spirit. Looks like a ram said, clear as day, just from a sunlight refraction. But it's like it's spot on what Ram said.

26:54 Look like that's crazy, that's really interesting. Do any other individuals in your family also have interesting I guess spiritual encounters or anything that's that's happened to them over the years, or are you do you feel like an outlier in your family? Oh, I'm the black sheep, gotcha. But like my uncle, he lives ready across from the property. The woods were happened that he grew up there his whole life, and not one time as anything ever happened to him, No, not one thing at once. And like I've been up in there a bunch, and I've had quite a few things, So I just I don't know, I don't think he's open to it or I really don't know.

27:43 Well, I mean, and I'm glad that that got brought up to Dustin because it's it's interesting. The other thing I find out as I go further into this is that it almost feels like you can take you can take two different people. One person can be very buy the book, I don't care about anything unless it's going to be evidence. You know that I can just to feel with my hands, right, Or you have another person that is very like open to things and like here to experience, you know, whatever happens, you put them in the same area. I mean, I've seen it happen. I've seen both of those types of people in the same area, and when the one person is there, nothing happened. When that other person is gone and the other person is there that's into like experiencing things, the stuff that happened was crazy, And I don't know, do you have any thoughts about that kind of thing happened off of the way that you are looking at things through your worldview at all?

29:07 Oh yeah, so energy, like the vibration thing. What you vibrate is what you will attract. So if you're in the company of a negative person or somebody that's that doesn't believe or wants the hard facts, they're not going to get it because they're shut down to it, which is going to dampen the vibe with you because you're not radiating your vibration at your full potential. It's all about the law of attraction, law vibration. What you what you think, what you feel, will turn into reality eventually. In my experience, is are all my opinions? Of course, that's interesting, so it man. So if we're taking that viewpoint, which does make sense, I'd have to say, you really do have to be careful who you are going out with when you're you know, going looking, because it could really affect a lot of what ends up happening.

30:07 That's very interesting. Yeah, absolutely, you want to watch the company you keep for sure. Yeah, it'll make or break your situation. So your your girlfriend that you go out with, would you say she's pretty much on the same level as you are with how you view things? Oh yeah, So that's where my spiritual stuff gets even crazier. Big for society. Who will be right back after these messages.

30:52 I don't know if anybody's heard of the twin Flame journey, but I come to find out that I am an actual twin flame and so she were counterparts meant to raise the collective conscience of yourth together through spiritual work in the five D basically, and we just we vibe just two p's in a pod, you know what I mean. It's we're on the same vibration for sure. So that that sounds interesting. Can you explain to me a little bit about what what the term twin flame means a little more? Yeah, So, twin flames are two souls that were incarnated together at the beginning of time. Supposedly, I'm still prettying net all this and figuring it out, so bear with me.

31:40 And there's there. They get split and then each time you get reincarnated in a different lifetime, you find each other and you trigger each other's deepest core wounds in order to heal yourself and the paths about ultimate self love. It's like me and her have been together in multiple past lives and we created all this karma basically, and all these past lives and now in this lifetime we're working on clearing all that karma and healing ourselves to our core wounds of like you know, childhood trauma or anything significant PTSD stuff. It literally is like a fast track to healing. And it does sound romantic, but it's the most gut wrenching, hardest thing I've ever been here in my life. It's the most rewarding. Yes, but it's not what people think it is. People hear twin flames, they're like, oh, you're my twin flame. No, there's not.

32:38 Everybody has a twin flame, and if you do, you will know it because it will wake you up right now. It'll slack you in the face and say, hey, this is life here, bud. We're going to get you on track. That's my experience with it. But it's great that it is absolutely phenomenal. That's really cool that you have a connection to to someone like that. I know a lot of people could say that, but I'm pretty sure not everyone can say that. So that is that is very very cool too. To be aware of someone that you know is into everything the same way you are and in all that good stuff is it's very very cool. You know, we did talk about Forbes State Forest a little bit earlier. Have you have you also heard of of any Bigfoot related things happening in that forest?

33:42 On the Yeah, on the PA Bigfoot Legend map, there were oh, probably four or five pretty good encounter descriptions. This one guy that he was both hunting up in this roommate bush and heard a loud scream or roar like I did. This other guy heard roxy being thrown at him and smelled this awful pungent smell. And this is like right where you like it all the time. But other than that, you go up towards like Miller, ng PA. There's countless I mean countless encounters up there confluence area that's all off the Greater Allegheny Bike Trail too, So I'm sure there's some encounter on that bike trail because that's just nothing but wilderness up in that area.

34:33 Absolutely, You've so you've had some. I guess what we would say is class be encounters like I've had myself, which is, you know, you hear things, but you haven't had a visual yet. Would you ever want to have that experience where you actually have a visual of big Foot? Oh yeah, I'm totally off into if I'm like out in the woods by myself, like I can depending if I can get out of there or not. You know, I want I want him to take me.

35:18 True, I wouldn't either, I mean that I'm not really on board for a missing four on one situation. Yeah, but once again, I think that'll honestly all comes down to your vibration as well. Like all these encounters I've listened to and stuff or people have guns, they don't go so good or like even my first encounter, for example, we were up in the woods, is that loud jeep. We were being destructive, we were cutting fire when we were being loud obnoxious boys, and he said, no rants out. I don't think he likes cameras. I was taking pictures and scared me off. But I think if you're like just being really zen, being yourself, being your authentic self and not causing any harm, if you have good intentions, I don't think they're gonna bother you.

36:11 I mean, I guess that's my experience because I feel like I would have had more encounters or something else happened to me by now with all the remote places I go, but I try to keep my energy in check. And they're like, I bring a trash bag with me, and I recommend everybody do this. Take a trash bag with you and you hike and on your way back out kick up all the trash city mother Earth. Well, thank you, you know that's what's the one. I totally agree with you two. That's an interesting It's an interesting thing I've noticed in a lot of my interviews with talking to individuals about bigfoot but that are also like very open to two different mindsets, and usually they end up getting some sort of leaning towards becoming involved with conservation effort or helping clean up the woods in a certain area. It's just it's really interesting. I don't know if there's any you know, connection, or if it's just you know, you get that respect for bigfoot but also the environment it would live in. So I don't know, something I've noticed.

37:36 Yeah, I just I started doing it like pretty hardcore this past fall, carrying the trash bag with me, and something just told me to start doing it. Kind of like my intuition is like, hey, you need to start cleaning some of these places up because it's places like a hiking all the time and it's just littered with trash next to rivers and stuff. And well it takes two seconds and and once again energy you do good, you get good back there you go out. Yeah, I man, I think if well, I mean just imagine if everyone that went out to a nature area and spent a few minutes cleaning up stuff, filled out it, filled up a trash bag and then you know, put it in the right area on the way out, things would be things would be a lot lot better for sure.

38:27 About Justin, it has been a really fun chat with you. I want to make sure that you know if there's that there, there isn't anything else that you were wanting to share, that you were able to to share everything that you had planned on on sharing so far. Yeah, that pretty much covers all my crazy stuff. Fantastic. I appreciate you coming on. It's it's always, I think, great to get viewpoints that might be a little different from our own. But also it's very interesting about making sure that our intentions match and are focused on the right things and how that can affect our outcomes. But I appreciate you coming on on the show. Has been a privilege to talk to you, and thank you so much, Sustin, thank you, I appreciate it. Just wanted to take a few minutes to say thank you to you all my listeners for listening to the podcast. Please take a minute to help out the show by subscribing on YouTube. Making sure you hit the bell so you don't miss any notifications, and share the episode on YouTube with a friend. Also, if you're listening to us on a podcast, Thank you so much, make sure that you're subscribed share the show with a friend. Really, it's all about sharing the show wherever you can. If you've had a bigfoot encounter related

39:58 to the following or know someone who has, please reach out to me at Bigfoot Society at gmail dot com or pass on my email. Here's the list. Number one encounters from Franklin County, Texas. Number two encounters from the entire state of Iowa. Number three encounters from Oakridge, Oregon or the surrounding area. Number four any individuals that know about bigfoot being flown off after the Mount Saint Helens eruption. Number five. Individuals that have had a bigfoot encounter while in the military. Number six. Those that have had a bigfoot encounter in the southern New Hampshire or north central Massachusetts area, including Franklin County, Massachusetts. Number seven. Individuals that have had a bigfoot encounter in a Bible camp or boy Scout camp setting. Number eight individuals that have had bigfoot try to enter their house forcibly while they were living inside, number nine individuals that have actively have a bigfoot living on their property, and lastly, any sightings that are in the Wachitaw National Forest area of Oklahoma or Arkansas.

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