The Dewey Lake Monster Returns with Shayn Jones

0:00 Welcome to Big for Society. If you have Bigfoot activity to report from the same areas discussed in this episode, please reach out to me directly after this episode. And if you'd like to be on the podcast to discuss a personal Bigfoot encounter, please reach out to me directly at Bigfoot Society at gmail dot com. Do you wish there was more Big for Society to listen to you every week? Well there is now. If you become a supporting member over at Patreon, you get a special members only episode every single week on Wednesdays, and sometimes even more episodes. Head on over to patreon dot com. Forward slash the Bigfoot Society and now let's get on with the show, all right. Big for Society.

0:40 I've got the privilege of talking to mister Shane Jones today. You may notice he is here in his awesome studio and he's from the podcast Inquiries of Our Reality and Bizarre Encounters with Shane and orin you may notice him as well. I believe he is mentioned on the Phantoms and Monsters as well. But Shane, it's great to have you here today. Absolute pleasure to be on the show man. Actually, we've had a couple of different bouncing around type of scenarios where we saw each other at multi Monster Fest and we just never came around to anything. So hey man, it's been a couple of years, but it's nice that we're finally able to make this work and we're finnellly able to have a one on one conversation. Oh absolutely, you bet you're one of the names on the list.

1:22 I'm like, oh man, I. Gotta get Shane on. And I saw you last year in Canton. I was like, yeah, no, it was this year. A lot has happened this year, Shane. Tell me, let's start here. So tell me how you got into all this craziness that you've got going on with your your shows and phantoms and monsters and all that good stuff. I mean, it's kind of somewhat of a long story, and I mean, just like most people that kind of dive into all this kind of stuff. I mean, I've had my share of my own experiences, not too many Sasquatch ones, but I'm sure at some point we'll end up coming back around. I end up sharing them today. But having a lot of paranormal experiences, astro projection experience and stuff when I was growing up, but on the other side, of course, digging into more of the Sasquatch side.

2:04 My grandma was one hundred percent Cherokee, so I grew up with there telling me different stories about Sasquatch, of course, using different names and everything, but that was one thing that started to spark my interest in the Sasquatch. So it's kind of been this thing that's kind of lingered around my whole life that you know, I was into aliens, I was in the Sasquatch, cryptids, I was into the paranormal and everything, having my own weird experiences and everything, and then, you know, one day, listening to podcasts and stuff, decided that I feel like there wasn't a lot of people that would have asked the same questions that I would have asked. So that's when I kind of started getting the idea that I wanted to start up my own show. So what I ended up starting on my show about was just basically having these open conversations with people, diving into cryptid encounters, people's different research and investigating into the cryptids and UFOs, aliens, spirituality, anything open minded fringe, and from there, of course, it kind of started to find my path that started leaving me started leading me more down in the cryptids is a path more so than anything, because that seemed to be the one that sparked my interests the most, sasquatch being of course my absolute favorite, but I dive into all the different cryptids and everything. So from there, of course, kind of diving into the cryptids and everything, I ended up starting up my other show, which is Bizarre Encounters, and that one, of course started off like a lot of the really great podcasts out there, where the intention was to bring in a bunch of encounter reports and that people talk about their experiences and everything. But as that one started going on, my original co host ended up leaving the show just because he was focusing on his own podcast and everything at the time, and it was a side project.

3:28 So I came around with this guy named Oran, and we had this really awesome back and forth where we kind of get unhinged, joke about stuff, but you know, kind of get to the roots of research, throw our own ideas and theories and everything at it. So when he first started off, started more as that encounter interview type show and still kind of keeping along the same themes. He was always a researcher. I was always a researcher, so we'd like diving into our own research and throwing our own ideas and everything. So we ended up started starting to push that show more towards mainly US deep diving into different topics bizarre encounters that people have had pertaining to you know, cryptids, UFOs, aliens, parent all that kind of stuff. And that's kind of just honestly let me down the way with my podcast and everything that I've been doing. And we started doing presentations and stuff at different events and everything, and along that path somewhere I ended up tangling with lown strict liffent phantoms and monsters.

4:14 So I ended up becoming the cryptid and paranormal investigator for Michigan and Indiana and or my coast for Bizarre Encounters is the one for North Carolina for cryptid and a paranormal investigators. So it's been a fun path and there's no end in sight as far as I can see. So I'm having fun with it and taking in weird experiences and you know, diving into the strange and the bizarre every day. Because I mean, if you don't have to start a podcast and you're not having these conversations on podcasts. There's not enough people in your normal life to have these conversations with. Oh absolutely, yeah, that's a that's a great way to look at that. So you are, are you based out of Michigan or Indiana? Then I'm in Michigan. I'm kind of in the Detroit area. So right now I'm kind of in this weird spot where it's like, if I go north, there's a lot of cool stuff to look at. I go south, there's a lot of cool stuff to look at. But Detroit self very city based, so unfortunately we don't get a lot of sasquatch reports or crypti reports. There's a lot of paranormal stuff, but not enough ma area that I'd like to dive into. So half the time when I go squatch and I'm taking up a couple hours of the north, a couple of hours to the west, not too much to actually do in the Detroit area. I mean, there's some sightings a little bit north, but I feel like there's just too much city and not enough room for a squatch to roam over here. Yeah.

5:24 The only the only one I've ever heard is when I talked to violent Jay from ICP. But that's that's a different episode. He added a Sasquatch encounter back in the day in Detroit. But anyways, so you have a Cherokee background, which I find fascinating. I've talked to a few people witnesses that have had Cherokee that have a Cherokee heritage, and they have some really interesting things that have happened to them over the years. So did you grow up with talking to any grandparents or relatives about your heritage? Or My grandma, more so than anything, She's take me to pow wows and stuff like that when I was really young, but I don't remember too much of those. But I do remember a lot of the stories that she would tell me, And the main one that she'd always end up telling me all the time was this whole idea about Sasquatch and the native tribes used to live one on one with each other. They used to trade, they used to have communication back and forth. And she basically told me that when the white settlers and everything came, they pretty much gave him this proposition and said, if you guys start trading with them, then you guys aren't gonna have contact with us. Anymore, and obviously they ended up wanting to trade with the white settlers and everything, so then that's when the communication kind of broke off and they started becoming this elusive thing, like different variations of that, of course, but that was always the main story that I heard from my grandma, more so than anything, of course, with the random little side stories about you know, women getting pulled off or taken off by them after all that went down and everything, and there's just all this like little weird, little background details she'd throw in, but the majority of it was usually pertaining back to this event of the white settlers coming and then having

6:57 that breakof and fortunately they went missing for years. They didn't hear too much from them, and then all of a sudden they started popping back up. And I know that at least her grandma had some type of experience. I don't remember too much about it. I just remember her having some sighting when she was a little girl where she was on by the river or something like that, and she ended up seeing this giant, hairy man over on the other side. But I don't remember exactly what time period that was. If it was my grandma's grandma, I'm assuming it had to have been like early nineteen hundreds, and that family is from down in Georgia, so that had to have been somewhere down in the Georgia area. I know that she was part of the Red Glay tribe, so I don't I think that's more of the mid eastern side of the state, So it had to have been somewhere over there in the Georgia area at least for that encounter sightings.

7:41 That's extremely interesting. What a cool childhood that would have been to have access to growing up in an atmosphere of stories like that, for sure. Did hearing those and living through those those stories as part of your upbringing, did that affect how you view sasquatch now or is that view something you've just kind of put together as you've gotten older. Honestly, it was one of those things that it sparked my interest in it, just kind of believing that there was other things that were out there that weren't exactly as mainstream signs would tell you that they are. Unfortunately, she ended up passing away when I was in seventh grade, so she was already gone before I really started getting super heavy into this kind of stuff. Up until then.

8:24 I mean, honestly, I was. I died into aliens more so than anything. But I always took in all of these different side stories and everything like that that you would always tell me. So it definitely laid the groundworks at getting where I am now with it. But it was one of those things that I kind of set it down for a while and became one of those people that were religiously watched, like the NASSA cameras and everything, and it was just heavy into the alien stuff. But when I started coming back around, of course, you know, these stories started coming back up in my mind, remembering all this stuff that you would tell me when I was a kid, and it could kind of took on its own light from there. Of course, like I don't necessarily know which camp to fit in the Sasquatch because there's just so many different experiences and such a vast variety of experiences that I wouldn't be able to gamble and say that I think it's specifically this, this or this.

9:07 But honestly, I take in every single theory. I take in every single idea, but at least from the stuff my grandma was telling me, I feel like there is definitely more of an intelligence factor to these things, where I don't think that they're just this animalistic type being that just chases through the woods just destroy things. And I think that there's like a motive behind that, Like when people have these aggressive encounters, they're trying to push them out of an area, they're trying to keep them away from maybe they're young, something like that, but I think that's usually that's that's more so than anything. Probably what my grandma telling me all these experiences and stories growing up with is that I have this hankering the back of my mind that they're not necessarily this like big scary creature that everybody makes them out to be. Of course, you know, you have to kind of take that with a grain of salt, because you could go into the woods and you know, have all of these things to carry you off in a you know, sleeping bag.

9:54 You know, like we've fard a couple different experiences of that happening. But I don't know, there's just something in me that tells you these things aren't necessarily as primal as most people believe they are, that it's kind of just something that they put on in order to keep humans away from them. Because I don't know, I feel like the intelligence factor is there that they're equal to us. Maybe not necessarily like way smarter than us, but I think that they're at least equal to us and intelligence up to the point at least where they kind of have their own tribes whatever you want to call them, hordes whatever. Usually people you refer tom as tribes, but I think they have like their own groups that they stay in and they specifically try to just avoid humans at all costs because they know what kind of death and destruction humans can bring, especially after again those stories my grammar told me simably read. After that was when the white settlers started bringing like rifles and all that, and that's when people actually start shooting at these stas quats, because an arrow is one thing, but when you actually have an actual gun, I feel like that's when you want to become elusive from these humans, because that's when the hunting party start to come, and that's when they start you're just trying to take these things down for a trophy. And I mean diving into old diaries, how many times you heard about these men trying to chase down this giant creature just for trophy or game. I mean there was was it Roosevelt. Roosevelt actually had exactly at some point that he wrote about. So, I mean it's kind of trickled in there. It's just they're not referred to as sasquatch. This stuff's hard to find. But so somebody finds something. Man, it gets thrown around the community, so everybody becomes aware of it pretty quick.

11:20 It's it's pretty wild. And I will definitely agree with you that the I think personally the intelligence at least matches ours. I will probably go a step further to say probably a little probably more just as like some I would say at least ours. Though, Man, there's some wild stuff. I mean we both talked to Ronnie Roseman, right, and so, oh man, that dude has encountered some wild stuff. And I mean, my listeners, if you enjoy all of the interviews that I've done with Ronnie Roseman, Shane has also been privileged enough to interview him. It was was it on increase that you.

12:00 Yeah, it was back on inquiries probably like at least four or five months ago. I'd say I'd have to look back and figure out the exact episode number, but yeah, we ended up spent two hours telling me all about his crazy experiences and we went beyond Sasquatch. Actually, I bet you probably got into Did you get into some of his alien and UFO? Yep, because he said that that's one of those things. He doesn't know if every single show wants to get into it. But as soon as he started bringing up alien experiences, I'm like, whay am on me, man, I want to hear him. That's awesome, So I'll I will definitely make sure I have the link for that in the show notes so my listeners can check that one out as well, because I'm sure they would.

12:43 They would love that. Have you yourself personally been able to go out and experience anything related to Sasquatch or maybe something semi related So. Me myself, I haven't actually had any first I haven't actually had eyes on any of these things. Unfortunately, still trying to hopefully I have that experience one day. But you know, some people go their entire lives never getting it, or they only get it once. But if you're not out there and try and then I guess you're never gonna have the opportunity to try to do it. But the first time I ended up going squatching. We ended up going to this I think it was state Land actually, and we ended up renting out of cabin for the night, and we ended up being it was me and one other person, and we ended up being the first people there, and everybody else was gonna up coming the next morning, so we decided to do a squatschhike in the middle of the night, and at least from my experience, I feel like those seemed to me the best time to actually possibly actually come across something. Of course, you have those accidental encounters during the day, but it seems like these things are more active moving around at night. But I don't necessarily think they're nexturnal. I kind of think they do this balance back and forth thing where they kind of just lay load during the day and then they do their active hunting and everything else they're trying to do during the night. But at least this time, we ended up just kind of going for a walk through the woods a couple miles out. There wasn't anybody around, so it's not like anybody else was just trampling around the woods or anything like that. It was just us miles and miles of woods, and we ended up going for a walk down by this creek, and that's always, of course one of the first places you want to check, just because the mud soft and you never know which might end up actually end up potting there. So we ended up going down by there and didn't up finding

14:13 anything there, but we ended up leaving tracks of course where we ended up walking across, so we ended up going on this full hike. We end up going up and around this little valley that dipped down, and we did a couple of wood knocks, we did some whooping and everything, and didn't end up having any results or anything, but we ended up taking the same bath. As we came back. We kind of looped and then came back down across the river and we came back across that creek river there was our footprints, but going across one of our footprints, there was a giant barefoot footprint that was going sideways across it, and it walked into the creek, and then once it walked into the creek, it kind of went to the center where it was a little bit of a heavier float, and then they kind of just disappeared into the rocks and everything from there. But it was just one of those weird things that there's not anybody that's just running around the woods at three o'clock at night barefoot with feet that are bigger than our boots. And I've heard of this from a few different people about this. It almost seems like they do this kind of stuff intentionally. That I talked to Rick Fromino Squatch and he'd mentioned that he had an experience like this before where they had no results, didn't find anything, but on their way back they ended up finding their footprints again and found a foot drive footprint across their footprints, And at least from the show that I did with Rick a while ago, we kind of came to this conclusion that we're looking into it, and apparently it's somewhat of a military tactic that when you're following behind somebody, what you'll do to try to throw them off is you'll leave like one little piece of evidence that doesn't necessarily lead back to you directly, but they'll throw them off or they'll become paranoid and they'll start like slipping and looking around too much, and then they'll make themselves obvious.

15:46 So we kind of assume that it may have been something like this, which kind of brings in more of the intelligence factor to sasquatch because for being this primal being, it seems like they have these weird like war tactics that they seem to kind of use, Like you hear about like the death walls or people have different names for them, but they'll make those barricaded walls where they'll kind of corral deer into this specific area where they'll have somebody over at the end of the wall, or they end up making this like loop that there's one way in and they'll try to chase them into that. And I don't know, it just seems like they have all of these like weird, little like war techniques that they seem to use, and I don't know, maybe it's something that is inherently something that apes will eventually learn, because it seems like, you know, even when you go into humans as apes or you look into apes themselves, they seem like they end up waring amongst each other, like it's just something natural within primates. So I mean, obviously, at a certain point, stuff like this almost starts to become common sense after you've been dealing with this kind of stuff enough. But I don't know, just just a weird experience that I haven't quite been able to explain other than possibly either one it was complete accident, which it doesn't seem like Sasquatches make those complete accents very often, or two it was something intentionally placed to say, we're out here, but you're not gonna find us, So how would you just stay home and stop trying to look for us? That's kind of the impression that I almost got from that one.

17:04 At least how approximately long were those tracks that were over your footprints? I believe that they were about fourteen and a half inches. Man, Wow, in there you could see toes Yep. When we came back, there was a couple other like half steps that we weren't exactly sure if those were steps. There was that one definite step that went across our footprint, and that was the one that we wanted to make sure we got pictures of. But everybody talks about casting, this one was in the water itself. So it's one of those ones that's just an awesome fine, but you're not able to cast it because it's literally inside in the water, right on the bank you'd mentioned.

17:49 Did you call them death walls? Yeah, that's the term that I've heard before. I've heard a bunch of different people use different terms for these things, but the two ways that I've heard him explained, I haven't actually seen one of these things myself. I've just kind of about him here and there. But I feel like usually when people refer to them as the death walls, it seems like people will explain this like wall that they'll create with a bunch of broken trees, a bunch of broken branches and everything, and they'll be like a straight wall, and there'll be one that's supposed to be at the end because they usually find like bones and stuff at the end, and they'll have another one that comes in and kind of chases them along that wall. And then the other one that I've heard about is the one where they almost form. It's basically built the same way, but it's more of like a corral where they'll have one that sits on the inside, and they'll have other ones that will kind of trick a deer into running into this corral area where they're able to catch them. But I've only heard the term death wall heard like once or twice, and every single time I say that, people are like, I don't know what that is, But I don't know if it was actually a term that's actually been something used in the Sasquatch community, or if it was just somebody who had an encounter trying to describe what it was. But that was one of those terms that just kind of weirdly stuck with me, even though it doesn't seem to be something that flows around the community so much.

18:58 It's really intriguing. I've never really heard of it before. But maybe listeners can put in the comments where they've heard it, and I'm sure someone out there will will know maybe where Shane heard that, because that's very very interesting to me. There's something I wanted to ask you, and this is kind of putting you on the spot, but you'd mentioned that you were involved with Michigan and Indiana for phantoms and monsters, right specifically with sasquatch. Yeah, oh well, cryptids and paranormal as a whole. Okay, have you gotten have you ever seen any reports come in from regarding sasquatch down from southern Indiana specifically like Turkey Run State Park, or just like Southern Indiana in general.

19:45 I've actually gotten a lot of paranormal stuff down there. I haven't really had too many sasquatch reports pushed my way. It's one of those things where if there's something a lawn is interested in having investigated, he like kind of sends it to you directly. The rest of the stuff kind of just gets posted up the page. So of course I like dive through the page and read through the page. But as far as investigations go, they're kind of more hand selected, and it seems like the ones that I get more often than that or paranormal ones, because usually it's people that are a little bit more in distress where they kind of wanted me to come out and be able to check it out. But honestly, I've only gotten one don in Indiana from Lan that he actually wanted me to investigate myself. Other than that, of course, diving into like sasquatch and stuff, I've mainly done stuff up in Michigan, more so on the other side of the state, more so where like the Dewey Lake might sightings were originally at That was actually one of the other experiences I had was a couple of miles from where the Dewey Lake monster sighting was, And that's another one that we get into. If you want to at some point here. Absolutely, so that one that was actually my more recent one, and I think I've only told this on my show, and it only came up because Brian king was talking about Brian king Sharp was talking about, you know, actually telling your encounters, and it was one of those things that it's like, if you're the sasquatch guy, you're the guy that talks about this kind of stuff, you don't always want to share your encounters, even though you tell other people to share your encounter, because you don't want people to be like, oh, of course the sasquatch guy is the guy who had some type of weird experience or assumes that it's sasquatch or something. But this was one, like I said, relatively recent.

21:09 I didn't get to see anything, but it was just kind of a weird accumulation of different things happening that kind of made me feel like there may have been something to it. But essentially what happened here was that I have a friend that lives on the other side of the state. He's involved in a couple of churches and stuff over there. Riley actually shout out to him. He runs another podcast called The Midwest Mythos, and he had a friend who just recently bought this church property and they were having sightings on this property. They were having rockstone at him when they're taking out garbage and stuff, just like this weird little side stuff. And it was mainly just the guy who was running the place and then his son, and so he said he wanted to have somebody to come out there and investigate. So I ended up actually getting to meet this guy firsthand at Riley's wedding party actually, and I ended up setting up a squatch hike and everything out at this church property.

21:53 And the cool part about the property is that it's all private land, so nobody's on it, nobody's walking around. It was just us that were part of this watch group. And then there was a bed and breakfast that they have on the church property that they try to make a little bit extra money off of. But there's a couple of people there. They're all kind of hanging out around the bonfire. They weren't going for watch or nothing like that, so they weren't out doing nothing crazy. So we ended up doing the first hike where we had like the bigger group of people, where we had like the people that seriously believe in sasquatch, and then the other group that's just kind of like, oh, you know, I kind of want to see a sasquatch. Just go for a walk in the middle of the woods at night. If not all the skills, we had a walk in middle the woods at night. So as we started walking, you know how those two groups end up splitting. It's like the ones that are just kind of hanging out and stuff, they'll kind of end up way farther up in the front than the ones that are actually trying to research and investigate what kind of end up staying towards the back. And the first time we walked around, not too much happening. We passed across these couple of deer blinds and everything. Didn't notice any weird smells in any or anything, which is why I'm telling this story.

22:49 For the first part of it. Back to the campsite ended up breaking off from the groups, and the group that was actually serious about squatching. It was like three or four of us we decided to go out for a second, and everybody else was gonna an upstaying back at the church actually, and the guy who actually runs the property, the one I was mentioning, I want to come out here and investigate. The first time we went on the hike, I didn't end up actually being able to capture anything, but I had my GoPro running the whole time. But there was this a thick area of shrub and he said that he saw something big move inside of there, and I was actually looking directly at it when I had my camera on my head, but because of just it being dark and like the led light only catching so far, I wasn't able to actually catch far enough that I would catch where this thing was at. But we ended up diving down into there and kind of looking around to see if there's any footprints or anything like that, and there wasn't anything anywhere that this thing could go, and at the time, there wasn't like a bunch of flashlights or anything on it.

23:42 So it's not like it was shade or anything like he actually saw something back there, because he wasn't the type of guy who's just gonna start yelling out stuff if he doesn't see anything, because you know, he lives on this property. He's not trying to make it scarier than it needs to be because he wants to live here. And that's the whole reason why I wanted this place to investigate in the first place. So he ended up staying back. We ended up going the second time where it was just Riley me, my daughter went with me, and I think we had one other guy with us, and we went around for the second time. We got back up to one of the areas where there was one of the tree stands, and we got over to that area, I started smelling this really thick, musty, swampy, kind of dirty smell, and I ended up smelling it the first time, and it was one of those things where it kind of like hit you like a wall for like a fifty foot area where it was like you walked into it and then you could walk out of it. But it wasn't there the first time. I didn't notice it anywhere else, and it was just the first thing that kind of leaded up, led up towards something.

24:34 Then I started smelling this just weird off non it smelled swampy, but it didn't smell like how the swamp normally smelled. It was something extra like it was just this like dirty, thick smell. So after that I started kind of just paying a little bit more attention, And as we're walking down the path a little bit more over to the one side of us, it's all just thick swamp, like if you're gonna go off that way, you would have ended up being like up to your waist and mud and swamp water and everything. So it's not like anybody was out there by by any means. So as we're walking, I started hearing a bunch of splashing over there, So we start stopping. You know, I'm just kind of listening because I want to make sure it's not ducks or something in the water or frogs or whatever. So we we're doing this thing where we're like walking and then we stop, and then we walk, and then we stop as they start trying to hear something, and we're just hearing that splashing for a little bit.

25:19 But then the last time we stopped, I started hearing something that was off. Sounded like it was almost like in the middle of the swamp that sounded like it was doing this really faint like kind of sounds, but it wasn't. It sounded like it was like it was something bigger, but it sounded like it was intentionally trying to do it a little bit quiet and I wasn't the only one up hearing it. I don't know if I actually ended up catching it on my go pro camera or not, because I just had like this little clip on extra audio things, so I don't know if it would have picked up that's in the distance. I still gonna end up digging back through that footage at some point, but like I said, nothing super crazy. We could end up seeing anything. But it was just that weird thick smell that wasn't supposed to be there that just randomly dissipated, and then the splashing, and then there's this little slight that we're starting to hear off in the background, and we ended up trailing back. We ended up hearing anything else that whole time. And unfortunately, like I said, it was in the middle of the swamps.

26:10 I wasn't able to really get over there to look for footprints. I tried to push as far as I could, but it starts getting really really thick. Because it's all private property, all swamp. It's not like anybody's like maintaining all of this type of stuff, so you'd have had to dig into this kind of stuff. Like we went on the walk a little bit earlier, somebody took like a five step walk off the path and ended up falling into about three feet of water. So it was one of those type of places, so it's like you kind of have to stay on the path and just kind of watch. But we ended up deciding that at some point soon we're gonna enup going back out to this property. He still says that he's having reports. He still says he's having rock throws that's happened and stuff. So we're trying to do a thing where at least once a month we go back out to this property and we do these squat shikes. But this time we're going to start trying to limit the groups where it seems like I end up having the best luck when I go on squat shikes when you're not doing big numbers, but you're doing like groups of three, it seems to be like the perfect number for whatever reason. So the next intention is, next time we go out, we're gonna try to break into groups of three. We're gonna try to make sure everybody has a camera on them, and hopefully the next time I go out, I'll try to try and get ahold of the thermal device. Because if I would have had a thermal device this first time I went out, maybe I would have been able to catch a heat signature off in the swamp if it wasn't hidden somehow by the water itself for dipping itself down in the water. But again, you never know unless you have the right equipment. And fortunately it's one of those things that you know as soon as you have some type of something, you're like, oh, man, I wish I would have had this piece of equipment because this would have been the thing that would have made it so that I would have actually maybe been able to actually see something.

27:35 That's that's a legit that's a legit story you're involved with. Have you interviewed that guy about what's going on around his church? I interviewed him one on one. I told him at some point I wanted to kind of put together like a little bit of like a documentary or something like that. But I mean just kind of sitting around a bonfire, he was telling me all the stories and everything. It was one of those things that I want to go out to the property the first time and not just put a bunch of cameras and everything in it. I kind of wanted to just get a feel for the when kind of respect his property and everything. But the second time I go out, he gave me full permission where he said, you know, I can sit down, we can record these stories, all that kind of stuff. So hopefully next time I come out, I'll be able to give everybody the full background of the full story other than just the one on one sitter on the campaign and trying to pick up as much as I could about what he was experiencing.

28:21 Wow, that's going to be incredible when you get that together. And I mean, yeah, that would make a great documentary, that would make a great like podcast, audio interview series. Odd Man that is that's a really really cool thing that you've you've got yourself involved with. So I'd say listeners, that's That's one reason to keep up to date with what Shane is doing here. It sounds like there's some cool stuff to come. Side note two. Like I mentioned a little bit earlier too, that place is about five miles away from the original Dewey Lake Mins or Dewey Lake Monster sighting, So that is an area that has a history of sighting. So you know, maybe one day I'll make it out to deey like itself too as part of hopefully that documentary and being able to go out and check out that area.

29:08 Dude, I'm loving it. Oh man, I. Myself personally want to hear more about this. This sounds fascinating, so very very cool. H You mentioned that you're not just into too Bigfoot with your your podcasts, thinking of the different things you've been involved with there, maybe you know different people you've talked to. Are there any really interesting things you've gotten involved with the church, bigfoot interactions, any other interesting things you've gotten involved with because of your podcast. Not necessarily Sasquatch. I have gone on in a few different Sasquatch hikes, but nothing crazy as has happened. I get offers all the time, of course, in different places that I do have any intention of checking out. One of them actually isn't necessarily a watchy area, but it's this like haunted forest that's supposed to be on the other side of the state that I've had contact with the listener about for a while. So hopefully at some point I'll make it out to that and be able to check it out. Other than that, of course, doing different like paranormal investigations got to go down to Indiana and check out black Ford County Jail. At some point, I want to make it down to the Monroe House, which is like the Double House, which is supposed to be this like super haunted house that was like abandoned and there was a couple murders and stuff in it.

30:24 And actually a couple of years ago there was a paranormal investigating group that ended up finding summer remains in the basement and they ended up completely shutting down the investigation. The police had to come out and check everything out. So there's just all this weird based around this house. But honestly, from the podcast, it's kind of led to all these different avenues of being able to get out and be able to check all these different places out, from you know, weird creature sightings to paranormal sightings to haven't in too much extraterrestrial stuff. Of course, everybody has the UFO sightings, but it's one of those things that it's up in the sky, they see it, it's gone. It's not something that you're able to really get out there unless there's like the abduction abduction. But I've had a few people that have had contact experiences, but a lot of the time it seems like it's more of this non physical type experience where they like pull like their consciousness and stuff. So it's just a whole other, like weird level that it's just kind of hard to like get that solid research with that stuff, even though there is like the opportunity, it's just a matter of I don't know how people other than like talking to people.

31:19 If I had the abduction experiences and stuff, it's like one of those things that it's not like you can like get out in the woods and you know, be looking for aliens or something. I mean, you can look for UFOs and stuff, but it just seems to be less hands on. So I more so end up steering more towards the cryptid and the paranormal stuff because it seems a little bit more hands on that you can actually go out there and helpfully able to possibly see something. Absolutely. Have you ever gotten over to the Manistee National Forest area of Michigan. Actually, that is something that I've been digging into for a while. Of course, the Michigan dog Man for anybody that may not be familiar. My main documentary that I want to start working on at some point was about the Manistee or I wanted to dive into the Michigan dog Man, because I've a few people that have come on the show and talked about how they've gone to investigate this area, and they've had these people in black trucks pull up and tell them, we know what you're doing here. You need to get out of here. I've had a few different reportings of truckers and stuff who have supposedly shot at these different things. So at some point I want to make it out there and I want to make a documentary to it, But it's been a step by step process and actually connecting with that last story, I've been looking for somebody for a while who knows the manast and would actually be able to navigate the Manistee, and I've always I've found these different pieces of different people that I wanted to put together for the crew for that documentary when I get around to it. But I'm been able to find that navigator type person. And the last time that i'd gone out to again investigate that church property, the guy who owns that property is also somebody who knows the man of Stee and would be able to navigate her on the Man of ste So it's been a step by step process, but I feel like I have everybody together for the crew.

32:49 So the idea is that we're going to hopefully next time you go out work on the Sasquatch thing, and then the next project we're going to start trying to work on is a Michigan dog Man Man of Stee documentary where hopefully we'll be able to go out there, we'll be able to to talk to some people. I had different reports or setting these things. I actually did a three part series on it at one point for Bizarre Encounters, where I dive into it for about probably five hours altogether, diving into all these weird different experiences and these weird different cover ups and everything with it. But the Michigan dog Man, Manistee dog Man seems like there's a lot of there's this huge shroud of mystery around it where most people that actually go out to investigate this thing kind of seem to get pushed away more so than a lot of other places. And my question is that the dog Man er is there other kind of weird stuff going on there? Because it seems like there's these creature reportings, there seems to be something else weird going on, and definitely there's a lot of military bases in Michigan, so I mean, who knows, maybe that's somewhat of a tie to it, but at some point I'll make it out to that Manistee.

33:47 I can also tell you there's a lot of weird bigfoot stuff that goes on in that National Forest as well, And if you wanted, maybe another name I can throw out at you just to put in the back of your mind for this this research you're doing. Another great individual that knows a lot about that area is justin from Cryptids of the Corn. Knows a ton You probably already have him on the list. I don't know, but he knows a lot about Maynistee and that. So he's somebody that I have to hit up about that too, because I have his number and everything like that. I just didn't actually know that, like I've heard him of course talk about it and stuff, but it was just one of those things that I hadn't actually connected the dots to say, like, hey, maybe he would want to get involved in that because he knows Riley from Midwest Mythos too. So it's like we all kind of know each other and are tied to each other. But and even my coast oron Actually I ended up meeting him through Justin from Cryptids of the Corn. Like if I had known Justin, I wouldn't have met my coast Orin either. So it's just one of moost people. It's so close that you just end up looking over him on accent, you know what I mean.

34:46 Oh, absolutely, it's all connected for sure. You mentioned something that I found really interesting because it's come up in other areas. Is that you're saying, there's stories of people being run out of this area by guys, and are these unmarked trucks, dark trucks, or trucks with words on the side of them, or. So one specific one. I can't drop the guy's name because he ended up telling me this after the show. He pretty much said that he just doesn't want his family to know about this kind of stuff because they don't want him to know how involved he's gotten in different stuff because he he's a big sasquatch researcher. He investigates paranormal stuff, but he doesn't want his family to know that he's literally had like government officials like stop him, so he kind of told me this story like off off the record, but that's why I'm not dropping any names or anything. But at least from his story that he described, he was supposed to be meeting up with a group to be able to do an investigation in the Man of Stee. They had an exact location they got picked out where somebody supposedly had a sighting, and as they were all starting to come in, Al I think was supposed to be one of the last ones coming in and he ended up getting stopped by two black unmarked SUVs, is from what he described. And he said that they both stopped, but only one guy got out of the first one came up to the window.

36:01 He said he was wearing like a uniform, but it wasn't marked with anything, and he basically just said simple phrase that we know what you're doing out here and he needed to turn around and go back home. And then he said the guy turned around and got in his car, and he said they followed him until he seemed like he was leaving the woods and then they just kind of dipped off and went from there. And he said he ended up calling his friends to say, hey, I got chased out by these guys and they said, oh, we didn't see anybody, like you know, we're here. So he said he ended up trying to come back around to see if he'd be able to come back in, and he said as soon as he started getting back towards that area again, he said, the cars pulled up behind him and followed him until he veered away from the area again, like they knew he was going to double back around. And he said that his group that he went out with ended up getting to investigate. I don't know if they had any sightings or anything like that.

36:41 I heard his side of it, and he basically just had to go back to the hotel room and wasn't able to go and investigate. But I didn't hear if anything else ended up happening there. That is intense and it's crazy. So first off, I have to say, if listeners are listening to this and they are like, oh, yeah, I've had something like that happened, you can put it in the comments. You can also reach out to me directly through email Bigfoot Society at gmail dot com if you want to share a story like that, because I know they're out there because I've been working with some of you for about a year and a half to share certain stories and you're not quite there, but I'm just giving you you know, you can take all the time that you need because it's it's a really big deal when you come out about with stuff like that, that is.

37:25 That is wild. I think there's a lot more going on behind the scenes than we know when it comes to government involvement and bigfoot. In other cryptids, I. Had heard one of a trucker who supposedly was trying to go and fix his tire. He was like, you know, doing the thing or he was like hitting the tires and everything, and he started hearing some shuffling off in the woods and end up getting back into his truck. And as he got into his truck, he said he had one of these things that ran up on the window and ended up putting a shot into this thing's face and watched it roll off. He took off, did a loop, came back and he said there was a jeep that was pork there and they said like, oh, we saw some hanmil that was heard. I took off into the woods and the guy basically said like, you guys need to leave. So he left and then he said he ended up having these like people that have just come out of the woodwork and then call him and say things like you destroyed our property and you're gonna end up paying for it. And he'd have these like weird SUVs and stuff like that would sit outside of his house. But this wasn't somebody that I'd actually talked to. This was one of the stories that I dug up on the internet. This guy supposedly went on a couple of podcasts talking about his experiences. I don't remember his name offhand, but that was again one of those weird experiences where somebody won actually put a bull in this thing. And two had that government intervention saying something weird along the lines of you destroyed our property and you're gonna end up paying us back for it, or you're gonna get you back for it. So that gets into the weird bass thing. Like I mentioned that are these things as they appear or is it like with a lot of the phenomenon that I think that there's multiple things that all become a facet in the phenomenon that I think that there are these dog men being that are like sasquatch almost that are just something that are here and on the other side of it,

38:57 I definitely think that there is gene splicing or some type of government experimentation going on that they're creating these things, because even with those, I mean, how many reportings have you had with like dog Man, I've heard at least one or two reportings of people claiming that they're were wearing like military grade like bowldproof vests. So I mean, like just weird stuff. I mean, it's one of those things that, again it's somebody's encounter report, so of course you want to listen to it. You take it in with the grain of salt, but still something that just kind of sparks a weird, weird spark in the back of your mind and says like there's something there's there's a multi faceted aspect of this phenomenon, like most cryptid creature type of sightings. I don't think that most of these things are coming from one specific place. I think it's a combination of multiple things. Yeah.

39:41 Absolutely, And listeners are always trying to get me to get into the dog Man stuff, but I'm like, you know, I gotta stick with the bigfoot stuff because I want that to be my focus, but dog Man kind of slips in. If it's organically in the episode, then it can come in. But man, that dog Man stuff just freaks me out, Like and there's even dog fightings in Iowa recently that I've heard, and I'm just like, man, it can't even stay out of my home state, Like it's such a wild cryptid. It's never having a good time, you know, dude. I honestly think that a lot of these old really aggressive Sasquatch reports may have been dog Man reports and it just wasn't something that was brought into the language because there's still this resilience even with people in the community that they're just like dog Man were Wolf, like ah.

40:27 But I think that the weird the thing is there was this whole connotation of where Wolf, where people had this whole idea about like humans literally shape shifting and turning into like wolfside beings, not taking any consideration these things being just as the form as they are, Which is where I think a lot of the researchers are actually coming back around to this stuff now is because they're realizing it's not humans shape shifting into these beings, but there is some actual physicality to this thing. But getting back into what I was saying, though, I think that a lot of the old really aggressive Sasquatch reports, there is a probability that they may have actually been some dog man reports. It's just that people didn't have dog man on their mind. They didn't know how to categorize it and split it differently, because how many sasquatch reports have you heard where they have more of an extended face, where it's almost more of like a muzzle.

41:12 But they're like these old reports that you can't actually dive into. You can't really ask the people because they're not around anymore. They're somebody that's elderly and you can't really get a hold of them through the Internet and stuff. But miscategorization, man, I think that it's not necessarily that it's a new phenomenon. I think it slips way in because it's something that's always been there and now we're just able to split the difference, noticing that again one has the more elongated face and one's more aggressive, where one has the more cone shaped head and seems to be less aggressive on average, depending on, of course, what area you're in and whether or not it's provoked and what you're doing at the time, But more often than that, it seems like the sasquatch stuff is significantly less aggressive than the dog man encounters are.

41:53 Kind of freaks me out, But someone's gonna give me. Someone's gonna give me grief for not asking it, so I'm gonna ask it. But in the beginning, you. Quickly mentioned how you had gotten into astro astro related things as a young child, where like astro projection. So it was it's kind of like this weird, somewhat lifetime thing that's been happening where I kind of go in spurts of it. It's like a whole other episode all in its own, to be honest with you, But from the time I was a kid, I used to astro project without intentionally doing it. Where I would go to sleep at night, I would astra project and I would see things such as like myself sleeping. I go through these like weird obstacle courses and stuff once in a while. Vicki joy Anderson, if you've ever heard of her, She's actually dived into this a lot, with these weird like obstacle course type experiences looking in with this stuff.

42:49 But my differentiation would always be that I would get sleep paralysis after all these experiences. So I had it multiple times a night at time or multiple times a week at times, and that was always the differentiation between whether or not I was in a dream or I was in this astul projecting experience. But it started getting really really weird when I lived in this like I guess you could say like haunted house when I was a teenager, where there was this like weird dark aspect to it. But on the lighter side of stuff, like one thing that I had to use to solidify it in my head that it was actually something happening would be that I would go to people's houses that I was familiar with and my friends. I would tell some of my friends about these experiences just so I could connect stuff and not sound creepy. But I would like say, like you were sleeping in a room facing the wall, there was a coke file sitting here, there was this here, there was this here, and they're like, wow, that was exactly I was sleeping. How would you know that? And I'm like, I'm telling you, I've actually projected into people's rooms and I've seen this stuff. Oh wow, And like I said, I would have these, I would always get sleep for utsys directly after it. But when I started getting older, it seemed like this stuff started to dissipate a bit more, where I stopped remembering the dreams as frequently, but I would still get these sleepers experiences, and once in a while I would have some like super duper vivid dreams, one of which actually sounds like a said story at first but turned into a happy story. But this was during a time when it would kind of like turn itself off and on for a while. So I hadn't actually had an experience in a while. But my girlfriend and I were trying to have our second kid at the time, and we ended up having a stillborn well not exactly stillborn, but it was eight weeks and I didn't have a heartbeat, so it didn't end

44:20 up making it, of course, and I ended up having this experience in the middle of that before we figured out that she was pregnant with my son who's now going to be going on three in December, where I went to this place where it was like the middle of space, and it was like this purple nebula galaxy type looking thing, and I wasn't necessarily like floating or standing in it. I was just kind of existing within it, and this little boy, who was about between six and eight kind of area, basically said that wasn't a good vessel for me. I'll see in the next one. And a couple of weeks later is when I ended up figuring out that she was pregnant, and then a little bit after that I figured out that I was having a son. And this is one of those experiences that I keep in my head because I want to see if it's the exact same face. But as far as I can see now, judging a three year old off of somebody that's between six and eight, it seems like it's the same base. So I'm pretty sure that through these astral projection experiences, I may have seen my son before he was born. And in the process of these experiences too, which is kind of where I get into all the weird multi reality, different dimension type stuff on my show, is because I've experienced this kind of stuff myself, which is why I kind of get into a little bit more of the woo sasquatch at times. But one of the experiences I had was that I had gone to sleep at night and I woke up and I was in this other reality and I was trying to find my girlfriend, but I couldn't quite find her. When I found her, it wasn't exactly her. It was like a different variation of her. And I kept doing this where I would go to sleep, be in a new place, go to sleep being a new place, go to sleep being a new place, and it felt like it took like six months, and every single time I woke up in this new place, the girl I found wasn't quite

45:51 my girl. It was just different variations for and when I found I came back, I ended up having sleeperalysis directly after, which freaked me out even more because that's how I've always kind of connected these experiences. And I'm not a super emotional guy, but that was honestly one of the most horrifying experiences I've ever had, because I didn't know if I was actually going to come back. And some people may call it a dream. I know that there's time dilation within dreams, but it was one of those things that it was. It felt more real than real. And ever since then, I've always taken in the multi dimensional astral projection aspects of reality. A lot more into consideration, because it's just one of those experiences that I've had dreams like, I can't categorize it as that it was something way more than that, and honestly probably connects into a lot of the stuff that I do, where I of course get into the WU stuff, but I try to ground it in rational understanding of how that stuff could theoretically work. So I get really really heavy into some like really weird off the wall kind of theories on how I think of like a lot of different things work, and having that experience, honestly is what I think kind of connected all that for me.

46:53 Where it's like, you know, somebody's like, oh, shape shifters. My connection for shape shifters is I don't necessarily think it's something that physically changes the form, but something that's able to manipulate people's perception into seeing what it wants them to see. So when I dive into this stuff, I definitely dive into the WU aspect, but I try to round it in the most rational way that I could possibly understand it myself, because I don't personally see something completely changing its form. I see it as this thing has to be able to manipulate people's perception. And again I have all these off the wall theories and stuff, but it wasn't for that experience. I don't think that my brain would work in that same way. But it's been almost my whole life that I've experienced this stuff, and it goes in spurts. Lately, it's probably been at least six months since I've had any type of dream experiencedly paralysis, anything like that. But before that, it was getting to a time where it would be I probably have sleep paralysis like two or three times a week, but I wouldn't remember the dreams because it seemed like there was this stop off where I would always remember everything.

47:51 But all of a sudden, when I was like in my mid twenties, I just stopped remembering the dreams unless there's something like crazy super Vivid, which only happens once every couple of months. But like I said, this is something I could probably go over for like a whole podcast, But it's beally been like this weird, continuous thing that's kind of happened in my whole life. That's incredibly intense, and I had no idea that it would get so personal. Thank you for sharing that that's extremely personal answer. I appreciate you being so open with that. It's one of those things that it came to a happy ending of course after that, and I feel like if I'm one of those people that's always asking people to come and share their experiences with me, I got to be open with my stuff too. So it's like it had a happy ending. That's all that really matters in the end of it. But you know, you just got to be open about certain stuff. You expect other people to come on and try to share their super personal experiences they've been in the most horrifying experiences of their life.

48:47 Some interesting thoughts about shape shifters at the at the end there, and maybe not overly related, but have you been getting reports about pale crawlers or any thing similar to that over the last few years? So funny story, My main encounter that most people have me come on shows and talk about it is something that seems like it's related to that. That's a heavy aspect of research that I've gotten into where I don't think pale crawlers slash rakes are what people try to categorize the mass if you start diving into Native American more most people assume that the wind to go is this deer headed being that exists in the woods, and when you get into the Native American stuff, that's not how they describe it. They're these tall, lanky, decrepit looking creatures.

49:34 And the experience that I had, I said, I can get into it on a whole other podcast if you wanted to, but just kind of briefly sum it up. My girlfriend and I used to or been exploring, and we ended up going into this psychiatric hospitel that we used to explore all the time, and we've gotten to the point where we explored like the whole campus, all the different buildings and everything. So we ended up going to go and explore the tunnels which go all through the city, and we're just always scared of going down there and not having enough flashlight battery and stuff. But one day we justid to go down there, and as soon as we got down there, there was this like hole that was in the wall in the basement, and it looked like somebody removed all the bricks. And when I came down that corner, I turned to look in this room and there's this like metal hospital cart gurdy and there's this I hear this disembodied voice on my right side and it says, and as I hear that, I see this thing stand up and it's this tall, lanky, bluish, gray skinned, decrepted looking creature and it had this long, black, greasy hair on the top of its head. And I took off running and my girlfriend, I didn't tell her what I had seen. She had her friend with her, so as we're taking off, she's like taking pictures and stuff behind her, and we ended up catching this thing that looks like it's it's like non physical, almost like it was definitely physical what I had seen, but it almost looks like a spirit photo from like what we'd seen what we captured in the picture, like it's completely translucent, you can see through it. But I had a hard time categorizing this for years, right, I didn't tell anybody about it. I didn't know what to do with this thing, because every time I look stuff up, it would come back to wind Ago, but the picture wouldn't look like it.

51:01 So I started having farther back into the wind Togo and I actually again on Bizarre Encounters to the three part series on that stuff too. But what I believe I had seen may have been what the natives suscribed as a wind togo, And when I started actually looking into the lore behind it, where supposedly, you know, you're not safe from personnalwfall to last and they say that during like the summer months and the warmer months, these things go underground, they go into caves, they go places that are colder in order to kind of hold themselves from decaying more. Is kind of how the story in folklore it goes. And at least in these tunnels, it was like twenty thirty degrees lower than it was up on the surface. So all these weird little connecting factors. But that's what started kind of leading me down that avenue where I don't think that rakes and piell crawlers.

51:44 There are reports that just recently started popping up, but I think that it goes back farther than that. I think that we have given dear headed beings the category of being called a windygo and that's why you don't really find too many reports of that. You may find these like weird spiritual type of owners that people will have, but I think that those are more often than not something else that's disguising themselves as a common phenomenon or something like a tolba, like a projected thought idea in this specific area. But what most people I think are describing as windy goes or as pill crawlers and rakes may actually be what Native Americans would refer to as the windy goes. And it seems like a lot of people have semi aggressive encounters with these things, and that again also kind of fits like the wind to go war.

52:26 So I think that the only reason that this seems like a relatively new phenomenon it is just because we've found a way almost like recategorized it after something that's just been lost through time for so long. That's extremely interesting. That sounds like a really great series to check out. I'm gonna have to check that one out. But Shane, this has been such a fascinating conversation and we've gone all over the place places I didn't think we were going to go, and it's crazy to think that almost has been an hour already before we close out our conversation. Can can you take a few minutes to if you have any closing thoughts or any things that you want to make sure listeners know how to contact you or how to keep up to date with what you're doing.

53:11 Well, if anybody wants to check out my podcast, Increase of All Reality is my solo interview show where I have people come on and the researchers and experiencers all that kind of stuff, just an open minded conversation to my talk show. If you guys like the Deep Dot, so you guys can go and check out my other show, Bizarre Encounters with shanean Oran. I keep all of them under a category of Open Minds Media, which is like my overall production company, trying to put it all in one place to make it easier for everybody. Under that, of course, we also do a side show called Bizarre Increase, but that's just a short form on Slash once a month YouTube show. But if anybody ever wants to go and check out anything that I do, you guys can go to the link tree, which you'll have links to all three of the different shows that I do. It's La NK, tr period EE, Slash, Open Underscore Minds Underscore Media, and from there, of course I always like to take in Encounter Report, So if anybody has anything that they would like to report, but you guys can go to that link tree and there is a submission forum for reporting an encounter. There's also one for contacting me if you're somebody that might be interested in coming on my show as a guest or you guys can also email me at omm encounter Reports at outlook dot com. If again, if anybody else wants to submit any encounters.

54:16 That's fantastic, And make sure that you are definitely following Shane's feed as I will be going on one of his shows sooner than later and I'll be in the hot seat, so Shane will be able to ask me some questions on his show as well. But thank you so much for coming on Shane. It has been a very enjoyable time with you. Well, I appreciate you having me on your show. Glad we're able to finally get around to do this, and it was always nice to have a one on one conversation with you. After passing me around in the community a little bit. You got to stop and talk at Small Ti Monster Us for a minute or two there, But there's just always something about having that full hour conversation one on one that just kind of, you know, makes a new friendship.

54:57 Man absolutely Stay tuned for teaser from this week's member only episode in counter Pelooza eight. You can listen to the whole thing by becoming a Patreon supporter over at patreon dot com forward slash the big for Society, or going over to YouTube and becoming a channel member over there in tier two or above enjoy. I grew up in the woods. I grew up in Oregon. I never thought a whole lot about Bigfoot. It's sort of that local legend that nobody, uh everybody talks about. My dad was a forester and I was taught that the forest was the safest place you could be. So I have been in the forest my whole life. I have never had any experience like that. And I took two kids, two of my children down for hike that day and we were kind of hiking down a pretty remote area. Nobody was there, and I kept getting a sense that something was like bias, but I couldn't see anything.

55:54 And I was slightly concerned about a cougar, but not really because I've only seen a one time in the wild. And my daughter then said, Hey, something I think is following us. So it was a little strange but then we went out into a big clearing area. Everything was fine. There was a space for a kind of a big area that was opened, so we decided how a picnic. We started hearing this banging coming, and I actually had no idea banging. Is associated with bigfoot. I just never paid attention. And my kids. Were like, what is that noise? And I was trying to figure it out, and I couldn't identify the noise. I was like, it's not a beaver, it's not elk running, you know. There was nothing that it made sense in my brain. And pretty soon it started kind of from where we had came down the hill, because we.

56:46 Went down about a mile and a half. There was the same knocking on that side, and we realized that the two knocking sounds sounded like they were communicating, like one would knock like three times and the other one would knock a minute or two once or twice, but never more than like four times, and so we were just listening to it. I was like, is it an echo? I was really just in my uh very cerebral brain trying to understand it. But all of a sudden, it sounded like the noises were getting closer like it was coming. Both were coming closer to us, so I kind of shouted out, like hello, thinking maybe somebody was down there working, maybe somebody didn't know we were there, and we didn't want to spook them. No response, still having our picnic, not concerned at this point, just kind of like this is interesting. And then suddenly on the side where we were supposed to keep going, it was so close. I would I'm not really great with distance, but I would say maybe a half a block, And at that point there was kind of a thick of trees and this tree started to flee back and forth like it was, you know, a blade of grass almost, And that's when I got scared, and I thought maybe a bear. But I've never I've encounteredbearer and bear run from you. In Oregon, we don't have violent bears. And at that point we started smelling the smell that it smelled like wet mossy muck is what it smelled like,

58:21 just kind of funk, and we were like, what is going on? At that point, I started to get scared. It never crossed my mind bigfoot. At that point. I was just kind of like, there's something going on and we don't need to be here, and I don't know what to do because I didn't feel like I could go forward past that whatever that was, and in that thicket of trees, I didn't feel like I could take my kids back the other way. My kids, I think, were about eight and twelve at the time. Long story short, I still get chills telling it. It's so scary, Long story short, I just kind of froze, and for the first time and only time in my entire life, I tried to call nineven one because I was like, someone's got to get us, like we don't have any way out of this, and there was no signal. But I had downloaded the map earlier that day because we'd never been there, and when I downloaded the map, I pulled it back up. I had it on my phone, and I saw there was like a service trail that was roughly where we were, straight up to the top where the parking lot was. So I started hunting for it and I could kind of see this skinny trail out and I finally I talked to the kids and I was like, well, we're not going to.

59:25 Go either one of those ways, so we're going. To have to go up that trail. At that point, the knocking is getting louder and louder and louder, and then my kids were like, look, and I didn't see a face. I didn't see a whole thing, but it was a very large, very dark creature in this thicket of maybe ten to fifteen kind of skinny trees. When I say skinny trees, I mean skinny Oregon trees, so like you couldn't wrap your hands around, but not like dugfur trees, not giant trees. So we could just see this like darkness, this big, dark, shadowy thing, and we were like, go now, and so we were crying. I still wasn't I thought. I remember thinking, this is so weird now, like it was a bear with rabies. I don't even know if bears get rabies, but that's the only thing that my brain could compute. Because this thing was not afraid of us. It was coming closer and the whacking was getting more intense. My kids were crying.

1:00:22 I was crying, and I finally said, listen, we're going to head up that trail, and I told them it's still so scary. I told them that they had to go first, and I was going to go last, and that if they heard anything, they were to run as fast as they could until they hit the road because I didn't know if this thing was going to come after us. Please take a minute to help out the show by subscribing on YouTube, making sure you hit the bell so you don't miss any notifications, and share the episode on YouTube with a friend. Also, if you're listening to us on a podcast, thank you so much. Make sure that you're subscribed, share the show with a friend. Really, it's all about sharing the show.

1:01:03 Wherever you can. If you've had a Bigfoot encounter related to the following, or know someone who has, please reach out to me at Bigfoot Society at gmail dot com or pass on my email. Here's the list. If you've had any encounters in Oregon, which I'm sure there's probably a few of you out there, please feel free to reach out immediately. You can use email Bigfoot Society at gmail dot com. A special thank you to all the Bigfoot Society, Patreon and YouTube channel members. It's your support that helps keep the show going and I extremely appreciate it. If you want to join in the fun, you can join over at Patreon dot com. Forward Slash the Bigfoot Society. I'll see you there and again, thanks for listening.

1:02:36 Her and I can get on here, we can tell our stories. Maybe there's somebody else out there listening. That's too afraid to tell their story. Maybe this will. Give them the courage to come out. And now it feels so bad about it. Who cares what anybody thinks. I know what I saw, I know what's out there. That's all I care about. Please let people know, Please let them know. If you've ever seen one of. These things, you need to.

1:03:16 Tell, because if you don't, then shame on you. You have. Shame on you.