An Ape Creature Ripped The Door Off My Well House And Bigger Creatures Were On The Way!

WEBVTT

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And through the night vision, I
see a dark silhouette of what looks like

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an ape on all fours come up, and it reaches up and grabs the

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door on the well house and proceeds
to pull the door off. And I

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see the little ape looking thing come
back, and then there's a second one

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with it. Then all of a
sudden, this huge dark mass follows them,

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and that well house is about eight
feet tall and whatever was taller,

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and I am certain it's probably the
same one that I saw across the road

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in two thousand and nine. Before
we get started with this show, consider

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this your warning. Albeit small town
Monsters, monster Fest and beautiful can't Ohio.

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This Saturday, June third, do
not miss it. It's going to

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be a once in a lifetime adventure. You'll be able to see Bigfoot Society

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live ten thirty am Central Standard Time. Do not miss that. I'll be

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interviewing Martin Grove, the Amazing dog
Man slash Bigfoot Researcher Land between the Lakes,

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Kentucky. You're gonna love it.
And please, if you're there,

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track me down and say hi.
And if you've got a big Foot story,

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I want to hear it, or
we'll get something set up for later

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again. I want to see you
at Monsterfest. Go to small Town Monsters

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dot com to get your tickets as
quick as you can and everything else you

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need. All right, let's get
into the show. But before we do,

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can't Ohio is an Eastern Standard time, not Central, which is Iowa

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time. So ten thirty East during
Standard time e st don't miss it because

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I just messed up. I'll see
you there ten thirty am Eastern Standard time.

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Beautiful, can't Ohio. Let's go. Thanks for coming back for another

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episode. We've got Jim Whitehead from
the Mid America Bigfoot Research Center with US

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tonights. And how's it going today? Jim, Yeah, it's going all

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right, awesome. And you're down
there in the great state of Oklahoma,

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right, yes, I am.
Oh, that's great. We were talking

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earlier and you'd mentioned that your main
research area is in the western part of

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the state of Oklahoma. And I
think it's about time that I chat with

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someone about the western part of Oklahoma, because I've talked a lot about southeastern

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as you can imagine, that's everyone
kind of focuses in on that. But

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Jim, tell me, what has
the western part of the state got going

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on with bigfoot research that people might
not realize. Number one, I would

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say probably the fact that there's actually
bigfoot out there. Everybody tends to hone

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in on the eastern part of the
state because it's more wooded, But the

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thing is, the western half of
the state's actually far less populated. There's

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a history of sightings basically west of
the thirty five corridor in the state,

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going back for quite a ways.
In fact, some of the earliest sightings

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in the state actually happened on that
end, but people are none the wiser

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about it. That's very interesting.
Is that anything you'd be able to share

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with us tonight as we're talking.
Sure. Actually, I've been working on

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putting together a chronology for pre nineteen
fifty eight sightings in Oklahoma as of late,

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and I can pull this up and
I can share a few of these

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old sightings with you. Great just
a second here, Okay, one of

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the oldest sightings in the state actually
came from the Dragoon expeditions with the Major

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Henry Leavenworth. And okay, it
really wasn't a sighting. It was more

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of an encounter with evidence. But
basically these guys were out and what would

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have been far western Oklahoma, and
they were talking about what they were calling

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prairie grizzlies and how they were weird. And this would have been about eighteen

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thirty five, but they were describing
the prairie grizzlies is hunting in packs,

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making nests and ambushing beer and breaking
their necks and stuff we would really attribute

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with Bigfoot today. And they reported
finding giant bear tracks that were in somewhere

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in the realm of eighteen seventeen inches
in length, and it's not very hard

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to stretch that into that being Bigfoot. Yes, it was part of the

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basically, it was another part of
the core of discovery expedition at Lewis and

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Clark were on. They had four
of those expeditions, but then they also

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had dragoon expeditions which were oversaw more
by the military men, but it was

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still part of the same program.
Is that the only historical event of Bigfoot

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pre nineteen fifty eight or there others
as well? Oh, there's plenty more.

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Perfect example, Rachel Plumber, who
was the sister of Kuana Parker.

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I believe she was actually captured by
comanches down in Texas and they took her

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into the mountains in south west Oklahoma, the Witchita Mountains today, which used

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to be called the the Sierra Jamon
Mountains by the Spanish fur trappers. And

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by the way, the Spanish fur
trappers they actually talked about things in the

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mountains they called the lobo zones basically
werewolves, but the Rachel plumber and this

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would have been about eighteen thirty six. Just a year later she eventually escaped

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and came back to a civilization,
so to speak. And what she had

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to say was she basically gave this
really detailed account of everything that she saw

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and heard from the Comanche and in
the mountains they told her about a hairy,

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giant wild man that was very terrifying, could use small trees as clubs,

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and she was she said she didn't
see it, but she said the

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Commanche tribe that she was with that
particular man said that they had encountered them

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in the mountains several times. And
this would have been near modern day Lawton.

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Wow, that is intense. How
can are these accounts you can find

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in normal history books or is there
a certain book that you've found use in

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or I've found them all across the
history books, historical narratives where they would

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go out and interview people. There
was a there's a great program with the

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University of Oklahoma where it's called the
oaklaom Indian Pioneer Papers, and they would

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actually go out and interview these people
right around nineteen hundred nineteen ten, and

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they were interviewing all these people that
were pushing one hundred years old old in

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listening to their stories in there are
some interesting stories in those papers. There

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are there's stories from the Arboco Mountains
in central Oklahoma. There was one woman

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that grew up near Davis named Amanda
Kimball. She was an African American woman,

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and she was talking about how the
bears would get into the corn at

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night. And she said, you'd
see the bears walk out there and they

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would gather up bundles of corn under
each arm. I should say, not

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pause, not eat, just stood
there and eat the corn with their mouth

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arms. And then they would walk
back out of the field and they would

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step over the fence like a man
and they would walk on two legs.

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Oh, my goodness. And these
stories are just hidden in this folklore project

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of the university. And you have
been smart enough to find these accounts.

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If one is really willing to start
poking into the history of it, there

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is a lot of stuff out there. Jim, how long have you been

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in the subject of Bigfoot? For
I officially have been researching since two thousand

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and six and joined the MABRC in
two thousand and eight. I believe it

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was the area I grew up in. We had a local legend about a

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monster, and I knew plenty of
people that had seen it when I was

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a boy, so there was always
that underlying interest. I love local legends.

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Regional Bigfoot stories are some of my
favorite. Did it have a name?

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Oh yeah, everybody out there called
it. It had several names over

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the years. Looking back, initially, the earliest reports in that region just

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simply referred to it as the wild
Indians. They would say there were two

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kinds of Indians. They said.
They were the kinds that were closed and

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he could talk to them, and
then there were the kinds that were hairy,

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naked and ran around in the woods
and would sneak up on your farm

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and still chickens at night. Over
time we had the it somehow became known

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as the hell Beast, and the
late eighteen hundreds. The hell Beast are

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wa man. Nice, Yeah,
and eventually it became known as the Criner

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creature. I like it. I
like that. I can't believe, man,

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I've never heard that one. That's
great. Yeah, The hell Beast

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was an interesting story because what I
heard in the locals, what I heard

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from some of the old timers had
actually told me about it in the area,

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was that essentially it was there was
a Choctaw man that his family got

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murdered and he went out and got
a bloody revenge. Then I supposedly they

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said that he'd grown so cold and
hateful because the act that he changed into

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a monster, according to the folklore
version. Now the truth is the guy

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actually just left the area a painful
memories and whatnot. That his story was

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actually recorded in the Oklahoma They're not
the Oloma. There was a true Tales

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of the West magazine. There was
an old magazine, and he just left

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and went to go live with some
family on the other side of the state.

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But the fact that there's this local
legend tells you that people were trying

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to explain sightings of something fascinating.
And when you're growing up, do you

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remember events that would include that creature
while you're growing up. Do you remember

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any of that from your childhood?
Oh? Yeah. There there were two

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guys that were living out there on
the land, Tony and George, and

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they they were pretty much making a
living, trapping and living off what they

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raised. And they heard something out
in their henhouse and they went out to

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check it out, and they thought
it was a coyote. And when they

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were going out to the henhouse,
something came out of the henhouse and stood

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up with chickens under both arms,
and it was way bigger than they were,

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and they proceeded to empty both barrels
of the shotgun they had directly into

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it from about five to six ft
away. The creature dropped to the ground,

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rolling, screaming, and it took
off, ran right through a barbed

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wire fence, and they followed the
blood frail for quite a way. It

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petered out and they figured to hold
up somewhere up in the woods and died.

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But yeah, the next day there
was blood and chunks of meat on

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the ground where it got blasted.
This would have been right in late seventies,

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early eighties. Then my brother was
actually hunting. Yeah, he actually

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had several encounters. He was hunting
up in a creek called Mushroom Gully,

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and it's just a spring fed creek. It's not too far from the old

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homestead, and he was going out
at night coon hunting and the dogs became

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really afraid they were there. He
was practically tripping over him. And what

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Tim said was that he decided he
had to feel when he was getting washed,

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so he decided to get a better
vantage point, and he got up

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on one of the banks and looked
around and standing across, he said he

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first thought it was a bear,
and then it reached up and grabbed a

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branch. That's this huge, eight
foot tall, hairy humanoid thing, and

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that scared him bad enough that he'd
He actually went further up the creek and

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then doubled back because he didn't want
that thing following him home. Another time,

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we had a farm pond, a
couple of big farm ponds out on

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the old place, and he built
a float house and he didn't see it,

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but something climbed up on that float
house and walked around with him in

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it, and it dane near tipped
the thing over, and it was just

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like a little think of it,
like one of those little pre made storage

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buildings, but it was basically he
made it himself out of scrap lumber.

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You know, I wasn't very big. And then going back I found out

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that my dad had an encounter in
the would have been the late thirties early

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forties. He was sweet on a
girl that lived probably about two miles from

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there, and he would ride his
pony up to her house. Officially he

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was going to play cards, but
he was coming back one day, and

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it was when he crossed Mushroom Gully, something big and black jumped out of

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the brushel on the creek and proceeded
the chasing, and he rode the pony

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all the way back to the house
and jumped off, ran into the house,

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left the pony out in the yard. And I didn't find this out

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until years after his death when his
brother, my uncle, actually told me

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the story is all is this creature
still causing half today? Two? That

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was one of my primary research areas
and still is that way, And I

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have collected a lot of sightings in
that area. It's one of little tiny

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town and you go there. I
mean the population in the town itself is

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probably less than one hundred and fifty
people. But you go there and the

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locals, a lot of newer people
that have moved in, they won't know

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anything about it. But you talked
to the old timers that have lived there,

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and just about everybody's got a story. They've either seen it or they

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know somebody who has, but it's
not something they talk about openly. It's

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one of those look ask them about
it. They'll look around to see if

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anybody's listening, and then then they'll
talk if they think that nobody's listening.

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Have you ever had a close encounter
with it yourself? Yes, on several

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occasions. Actually, there was some
stuff that happened when I was a kid

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that I kind of had pushed back
to the back of my mind. But

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I had a redbone hound I got
tore apart, and oh, I'm sorry,

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And I would have been about six
seven at the time, and my

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mother actually found the dog and she
went up to go get it, and

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she was coming back and something was
following her, but she couldn't see it

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due to the thick fog. No
birds, no bugs, nothing. And

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about that same time, I was
a little bitty fart and something looked in

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my window at night and scared the
crap out of me. But really I

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got back into it about two thousand
and six when I was going out to

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feed dogs. Was I worked at
a warehouse up in Oklahoma City, and

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it was almost an hour's drive back
home, and i'd get off two the

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more and so I get back here
about three and we had a really foggy

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weather system moving in. It was
extremely foggy, and I had a couple

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of dogs out in the pin by
the creek, and i'd go out there

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to feed him when I got home. And one night it was real piece

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soup fog, and when I went
out there, I could not see five

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in front of me. Back there's
something moving around. We had a llama

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out there in the pasture at the
time, and I thought it was the

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lama, But when I got to
the dog pins, I noticed the dogs

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were terrified. They were in the
corner shaking, trembling, And right then

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it clued me in that something was
wrong, and I called the llama and

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it gave an alarm call up on
the hill as far away from the creek

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as it could possibly get. So
whatever this was probably less than twenty feet

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away from me, but I couldn't
see it, and I knew it wasn't

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the Lama. At the time,
I didn't know what it was. I

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grabbed a shovel that I hadn't leaning
up against the dog pin because I didn't

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know what it was, and I
didn't know if it was going to attack

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me or what. And ME and
whatever this was circled each other in the

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fog until I made my way back
to the fence and off the fence and

208
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went back to the house. And
I couldn't find any tracks. The ground

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was pretty hard at the time.
And the next day and the day after

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it happened again whatever this was out
there waiting for me. But on the

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fourth night, when I got out
there, the fog actually lifted, and

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when I went out there, I
heard it take off of the creek.

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I could hear splash flash. I
thought, Okay, this thing's gonna have

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stepped in the mud. It's gonna
lead prince. I'm gonna know what this

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thing is in the morning. So
I went out there in the morning and

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I saw fifteen inch five tracks in
the mud. And there's nobody else down

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in that bottom except for my eighty
year old uncle and aunt at the time,

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And I know it wasn't them.
And then I got the research and

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it after that, and I pretty
much did everything that you probably shouldn't do

220
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as a researcher when I was because
I was new at the time, and

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I was driving down the road one
day and I happened to see one on

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the side of the road in the
daylight. It was actually eating willow leaves,

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of all things. I slowed down
and looked at it, and it

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puffed up a bit at me,
like an angry teenager. But yeah,

225
00:20:42.200 --> 00:20:52.599
that whole accounts actually in David Politi's
Tribal Bigfoot book. But yeah, since

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then, I've actually had a few
encounters in a few different research areas.

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So I guess I'm lucky that hard
you see the bigfoot on the side of

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the road, can you still picture
its face in your mind? Oh?

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Yeah, it's your eyes, And
so what do you see in jim when

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you're looking at it. Honestly,
it looks very human, but I wouldn't

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say modern. It looks very,
very archaic, very p pre Homo sapiens

232
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commented typeface, heavy brow, ridges, broad wide nose. The skin color

233
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was dark, almost grayish. It
was covered with the red reddish hair.

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The top of it was going gray. It almost kind of like a silver

235
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back grilled, but I remember there
was a bright patch of red hair on

236
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the top of the head. It
was probably about seven yeah, I'd say

237
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about seven foot, maybe a little
over. But the thing that got me

238
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is it was really stocky. This
thing was seven foot but it was probably

239
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about three feet wide. Was a
wall. And that wasn't the only sighting

240
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I've had in that location. Another
night, I was driving home again late

241
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nights, I was working up in
the city and that same creek system.

242
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When I was crossing it, something
much larger than the one I had seen

243
00:22:37.759 --> 00:22:44.920
ran across the road and it ducked. There There was a willow tree on

244
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the side of the road, the
same one that one had been pulling branches

245
00:22:48.119 --> 00:22:55.359
off of, and it actually fell
down a few years ago. But the

246
00:22:55.359 --> 00:22:59.319
thing that ran across the road duck
to get under a low hanging branch,

247
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and it cleared the road in about
two strides and slid down a rocky embankment,

248
00:23:03.279 --> 00:23:10.680
and I could just see a big, dark silhouette figure. The eyes

249
00:23:10.759 --> 00:23:15.039
were shining, I could see a
bit of hair on the legs, and

250
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the sighting was over just a few
seconds, and I guess that's far more

251
00:23:19.079 --> 00:23:26.039
typical of most people's encounters. But
I went back the next day because I

252
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knew it. Ducked under that branch
to see how tall it was, and

253
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I measured that branch right at nine
feet off the ground. So whatever that

254
00:23:36.039 --> 00:23:38.519
was had the duck to get under
a nine feet branch, meaning it was

255
00:23:38.599 --> 00:23:44.839
comparable in height. And then I
checked the rocky embankment. It slid down

256
00:23:45.880 --> 00:23:53.279
and I found hair. I took
the hair two lab. I've still got

257
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the sun of it. I did
some testing on it and at the college

258
00:24:00.240 --> 00:24:07.079
it resembled human pubic care, but
it was about five to six inches long

259
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and straight. And I showed it
the biologist at the time, which that

260
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the head biologist there was one of
the members of the Oklahoma Academy of Science.

261
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He was one of the board members. And this guy's got sixty years

262
00:24:26.119 --> 00:24:30.200
of experience with the wildlife in the
state. He couldn't identify it. He

263
00:24:30.240 --> 00:24:37.440
couldn't think of anything in the state
that it would be. Now, there

264
00:24:37.519 --> 00:24:44.240
was a group out of Texas that
had came up to Elreno and they got

265
00:24:44.240 --> 00:24:48.720
a hair simple and this location's probably
about eighty ninety miles from where the location

266
00:24:49.119 --> 00:24:55.480
that I had this sighting. But
they sent their's off to multiple labs and

267
00:24:55.640 --> 00:25:03.759
they kept getting unknown. They sent
it off for genetic testing, and the

268
00:25:03.839 --> 00:25:07.000
stuff that they got back actually stated
that it was an unknown genome. It

269
00:25:07.160 --> 00:25:14.799
wasn't in zo bank, meaning it's
an unrecognized species. So they gave me

270
00:25:14.839 --> 00:25:18.880
a little bit of their hair,
and when I compared the hair that I'd

271
00:25:18.880 --> 00:25:23.279
collected in the hair that they had
collected under a microscope, they were a

272
00:25:23.400 --> 00:25:29.880
match. The scale pattern was the
same, the thickness was the same,

273
00:25:29.960 --> 00:25:34.359
the overall morphology was the same.
There was a slight difference in coloration.

274
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That was it. So whatever they're
unknown is, I can quite confidently say

275
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that my unknown was more than likely
the same thing. How long ago did

276
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this happen again, Jim? That
would have been two thousand and nine,

277
00:25:48.839 --> 00:25:57.720
I believe that's wild. Yeah,
big foot, that's okay. So that's

278
00:25:59.720 --> 00:26:03.799
yeah, that's just long enough for
people to forget about stuff, isn't it.

279
00:26:06.000 --> 00:26:11.160
Man? That feels like that should
be bigger news. That's that sounds

280
00:26:11.160 --> 00:26:15.759
like a really big deal. Gym
wow, has that ever been written about

281
00:26:15.839 --> 00:26:21.359
in anything? Or it was posted
on their website? In fact, it's

282
00:26:21.400 --> 00:26:25.599
still on there I believe, Okay, not my end of it, but

283
00:26:25.640 --> 00:26:33.119
their lab results are. What do
you personally feel that we're dealing with Bigfoot

284
00:26:33.160 --> 00:26:37.240
as a creature. What do you
think this creature is. I'm a flesh

285
00:26:37.279 --> 00:26:44.119
and blood guy, I'm a science
guy. I can't say with any definitive

286
00:26:47.000 --> 00:26:51.880
certainty what it is until we have
an actual specimen to look at. But

287
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I can speculate based on what the
evidence is, what the data says,

288
00:26:57.680 --> 00:27:07.880
and right off the bat, I
don't think it's Gigantopithecus. There's too much

289
00:27:07.920 --> 00:27:11.799
going against it, and to be
honest, a lot of the mainstream hardcore

290
00:27:14.079 --> 00:27:18.680
researchers backing off from that idea.
Even Jeff Meldrum's starting to back off.

291
00:27:18.720 --> 00:27:26.240
It's my understanding he no longer is
really supporting giganto because the science isn't backing

292
00:27:26.279 --> 00:27:33.839
it up. But that being said, it is a primate sure on that

293
00:27:34.640 --> 00:27:38.400
if I had to classify it,
I would probably classify it as an archaic.

294
00:27:38.480 --> 00:27:44.200
Commented. We know creatures very similar
to it existed in the fossil record.

295
00:27:45.319 --> 00:27:52.200
We know that they were widespread across
the Old World, and we also

296
00:27:52.319 --> 00:27:57.200
know that during about two million years
ago, there was a lot of exchange

297
00:27:59.079 --> 00:28:04.079
going on between the Old world in
the New World via the Barringia, the

298
00:28:04.160 --> 00:28:12.880
land bridge. Because most people don't
realize buffalo actually came here during that time

299
00:28:12.960 --> 00:28:22.920
frame from Asia, as did the
jaguars and wolves. And on the other

300
00:28:23.000 --> 00:28:32.000
end of the spectrum, camels came
from North America into Asia, and so

301
00:28:32.200 --> 00:28:37.640
did cheetahs. That's wild. Yeah, this is genetically speaking mountain lines or

302
00:28:37.680 --> 00:28:41.920
the cheetah's closest relatives. Cheetahs are
from here originally, and we have fossil

303
00:28:42.000 --> 00:28:51.279
cheetahs. When I think of Oklahoma
Bigfoot, you always hear these just wildly

304
00:28:51.400 --> 00:28:56.640
aggressive tales. Is that the case
with Western Oklahoma as well? Or is

305
00:28:56.680 --> 00:29:04.160
that more of the other side of
the state. I think a lot of

306
00:29:04.160 --> 00:29:15.160
these stories of aggression are misinterpretations of
behavior, because Okay, get bluff charged

307
00:29:15.200 --> 00:29:18.440
by something, you're going to think
it's trying to kill you. But in

308
00:29:18.519 --> 00:29:25.599
all honesty, yeah, I do
think there are dangerous ones out there,

309
00:29:25.599 --> 00:29:29.519
just like any animal. It's going
to be unpredictable, but it's going to

310
00:29:29.559 --> 00:29:36.400
do what it does for a reason. There and I've said this before with

311
00:29:36.480 --> 00:29:41.880
researchers, there are actually quite a
few more reports of aggressive behavior I think

312
00:29:41.880 --> 00:29:45.440
in the western part of the state
than there are the eastern. But I

313
00:29:45.440 --> 00:29:51.519
think it might be because the environment
might be a bit more stressful. The

314
00:29:51.599 --> 00:30:00.319
western staff gets hit with drought on
a regular occasions, and there are there's

315
00:30:00.440 --> 00:30:03.200
not as much cover, so the
animals are going to be stressed out.

316
00:30:03.240 --> 00:30:07.920
And by the way, Oklahoma is
actually about two thirds forests that most people

317
00:30:07.960 --> 00:30:11.160
don't realize that. It's just one
of those things. These things do what

318
00:30:11.240 --> 00:30:18.000
they have to survive, and if
it means they have to get rough with

319
00:30:18.599 --> 00:30:25.480
us puny little humans, so be
it. That's really interesting. You mentioned

320
00:30:25.519 --> 00:30:32.839
that there may even be more stories
in the western side of the state that

321
00:30:33.599 --> 00:30:40.640
could be labeled more aggressive. Are
there any that come to mind? Yeah,

322
00:30:40.680 --> 00:30:45.519
to start off, I have actually
heard stories of two attempted abductions really

323
00:30:45.640 --> 00:30:51.519
in the western part of the state. And these aren't old stories either.

324
00:30:51.720 --> 00:30:57.000
These are within the last twenty to
thirty years. There was a guy who

325
00:30:57.200 --> 00:31:03.519
had been out deer hunting in the
Haystack Mountains, which is the far southwest

326
00:31:03.559 --> 00:31:11.839
corner of the state, and basically
something he was sleeping in the back of

327
00:31:11.839 --> 00:31:18.079
his truck on a Palllett of blankets, and something came up and grabbed him

328
00:31:18.119 --> 00:31:22.960
by the leg and started to drag
him out of the truck. And this

329
00:31:22.039 --> 00:31:26.720
is a kind of a funny story
because the guy said he started kicking wildly,

330
00:31:26.839 --> 00:31:32.039
not knowing what it was, but
when his foot made contact with the

331
00:31:32.200 --> 00:31:37.400
piece of anatomy that he later thought
about that was notably softer, then he

332
00:31:37.519 --> 00:31:42.319
heard a strange howl and seeing this
giant, hairy figure obbling off into the

333
00:31:42.359 --> 00:31:52.319
bush, and then he effectively said
he thinks he kicked bigfoot in the in

334
00:31:52.400 --> 00:32:01.279
the private area. What an amazing
individual. Can you imagine just having that

335
00:32:01.480 --> 00:32:06.200
on like a plaque on your wall
or something. That's a kind of a

336
00:32:06.200 --> 00:32:12.000
cool story though, because it does
line up with there's a report from the

337
00:32:12.119 --> 00:32:20.079
NAWAC in their area where a gentleman
was an arm reached through the window and

338
00:32:20.440 --> 00:32:23.960
starts dragging one of the individuals towards
the wall. And it's almost like a

339
00:32:24.000 --> 00:32:30.880
modern day Albert Osman type story too, which is cool man and horrifying.

340
00:32:30.440 --> 00:32:36.079
And again that's the next one came
from over near Elreno, that was pow

341
00:32:36.119 --> 00:32:42.000
wow going on, and one of
the girls from the Drive was over there

342
00:32:42.119 --> 00:32:45.200
and she wandered off. I'd say, girls, she's probably a teenager.

343
00:32:45.640 --> 00:32:51.279
But something actually shoved her over and
grabbed her by the leg and started dragging

344
00:32:51.279 --> 00:32:54.680
her to the woods. And she
said the hand that she felt on her

345
00:32:54.720 --> 00:32:59.720
lower leg took up most of her
lower legs. She said, the palms

346
00:33:00.000 --> 00:33:05.480
out the size of a frying pan. She was screaming and carrying on,

347
00:33:05.559 --> 00:33:12.920
and it dropped her and went off
on its way. And this is a

348
00:33:12.960 --> 00:33:16.480
witness I personally interviewed. She didn't
get a good look at it, but

349
00:33:16.559 --> 00:33:23.240
she thinks that's what it was,
a big foot. And then there was

350
00:33:23.400 --> 00:33:32.720
the story of what we call the
Monster War from the late thirties out in

351
00:33:32.799 --> 00:33:39.400
my area. And basically what happened
there was a family living in an old

352
00:33:40.279 --> 00:33:50.720
Indian cabin. They were building a
new home and the farmer that owned it.

353
00:33:52.000 --> 00:33:55.359
And I heard all this from his
grandson, who still lives in that

354
00:33:55.440 --> 00:34:00.359
area, or at least did a
few years ago. But he said that

355
00:34:00.440 --> 00:34:04.720
he heared something out in his goats, and he went out there and he

356
00:34:04.759 --> 00:34:12.400
had an old sharp's rifle and he
seen something in the goat pen and he

357
00:34:12.400 --> 00:34:15.119
said he thought it was a bear, and he shot it and it dropped

358
00:34:15.280 --> 00:34:20.639
and he went out there and he
said it was this huge man covered in

359
00:34:20.719 --> 00:34:24.679
hair. And about that time he
heard roars from the woods and realized that

360
00:34:24.719 --> 00:34:30.760
whatever it wasn't alone, and he
proceeded to run back to the cabin.

361
00:34:30.880 --> 00:34:35.079
And the cabin was actually sitting up
on a bunch of rocks that had been

362
00:34:35.119 --> 00:34:40.559
wired together to form little supports,
and his family was freaking out, and

363
00:34:42.280 --> 00:34:45.159
something hit the side of the cabin
hard enough to knock it off of those

364
00:34:45.199 --> 00:34:51.880
supports, and this thing proceeded to
basically beat on the side of that I

365
00:34:51.960 --> 00:34:55.400
say thing. Things were beating on
the side of the cabin trying to get

366
00:34:55.440 --> 00:35:04.800
in, and they were actually shooting
through the cabin at them, and the

367
00:35:04.880 --> 00:35:10.880
daylight came and they backed off,
and the family fled to the nearest neighbor,

368
00:35:10.920 --> 00:35:16.039
which was about a mile away,
and they almost got shot because apparently

369
00:35:16.079 --> 00:35:23.280
the neighbors got a visit too after
that, and they said that they had

370
00:35:23.280 --> 00:35:28.639
Actually they went back to their cabin
and they immediately buried the body of the

371
00:35:28.639 --> 00:35:32.159
thing that they shot, because they
were scared if they came back that night

372
00:35:32.239 --> 00:35:38.920
and it was still there, they
would attack again. And then they actually

373
00:35:38.920 --> 00:35:43.360
poured the foundation of their house over
it, and I have told them if

374
00:35:43.360 --> 00:35:45.639
they ever demolished that house, I
will be there with a pick axe and

375
00:35:45.679 --> 00:35:54.920
a shovel. Okay, okay,
okay, Wow, Jim, you know

376
00:35:55.079 --> 00:36:04.039
the people that's this is crazy stuff. So they built their foundation over whereas

377
00:36:05.760 --> 00:36:13.039
they're saying a dead bigfoot is buried. Wow, that's the story. And

378
00:36:13.079 --> 00:36:16.559
like I said, I've known that
family most of my life and they've always

379
00:36:16.639 --> 00:36:27.239
been really honest. Oh wow,
I can't say for sure that it's not

380
00:36:27.400 --> 00:36:31.440
something that got blown out of proportion. They ever tear that house down,

381
00:36:31.480 --> 00:36:35.119
I wouldn't mind taking a look to
see if there's a grain of truth of

382
00:36:35.199 --> 00:36:40.480
the story. Oh absolutely. And
how long ago? Roughly again did that

383
00:36:40.719 --> 00:36:49.199
happen? This would have been the
nineteen thirties. Okay, man, that's

384
00:36:49.280 --> 00:36:57.199
wild. Is there a book that
you know is the book for Western Oklahoma?

385
00:36:58.639 --> 00:37:05.559
Nothing information? Nothing, So Jim, it's all in your head because

386
00:37:05.599 --> 00:37:09.320
this is all stuff I've never heard
before, and this is incredible information.

387
00:37:09.840 --> 00:37:15.679
Jim. Has there ever been a
time when you're out researching and just something

388
00:37:15.760 --> 00:37:20.119
happens and it is so intense You're
like, if I could get out of

389
00:37:20.199 --> 00:37:22.679
here right now, I would definitely
get out of here right now, as

390
00:37:22.800 --> 00:37:30.079
anything like that ever happened to you
a couple of times, the one that

391
00:37:30.199 --> 00:37:37.679
stuck out to me was probably the
most terrifying night of my life. See

392
00:37:37.760 --> 00:37:42.639
my old farmhouse. The area I
was researching it was less than a half

393
00:37:42.760 --> 00:37:46.960
mile from my old farmhouse, and
I had a good friend of mine that

394
00:37:47.000 --> 00:37:52.199
had been staying with me after a
nasty divorce and getting back on his feet,

395
00:37:52.239 --> 00:37:59.239
and he finally moved out. And
at the time, I went up

396
00:37:59.280 --> 00:38:01.559
to an air that I referred to
as the Marker area because you go up

397
00:38:01.599 --> 00:38:07.039
there, it's like a little isolated
pocket of woods connected by streams to bigger

398
00:38:07.119 --> 00:38:10.440
chunks of woods, but it's up
on the top of the hill, and

399
00:38:10.480 --> 00:38:15.599
there's a pond and the hidden spring
up there, and you go up there

400
00:38:15.599 --> 00:38:19.960
and there's all kinds of crazy stuff
going on with the trees, all kinds

401
00:38:19.960 --> 00:38:27.079
of possible structures and whatnot. And
I'm pretty skeptical on stick structures, but

402
00:38:27.159 --> 00:38:32.639
when you find a tree as a
green sapling that's been wrapped around another tree

403
00:38:34.199 --> 00:38:38.840
and tied in a knot, that's
hard to explain. So I went up

404
00:38:38.880 --> 00:38:49.840
there, and that place tends to
give me the creeps, and I went

405
00:38:49.920 --> 00:38:55.119
up in there and basically I was
checking the markers, looking for footprints,

406
00:38:55.159 --> 00:39:00.039
that kind of thing, and it
didn't dawn on me. There was no

407
00:39:00.400 --> 00:39:07.239
sound, There was no birds,
no bugs, nothing was rustling around in

408
00:39:07.280 --> 00:39:15.400
the leaves. And it really should
have sunk in that That means something was

409
00:39:15.599 --> 00:39:23.199
probably there. So I'm in there
looking around and I hear a crack and

410
00:39:23.280 --> 00:39:27.920
I turned around and I get this
piece of it would be a good piece

411
00:39:27.960 --> 00:39:34.039
of firewood that's probably about maybe a
foot and a half long and probably about

412
00:39:34.159 --> 00:39:39.119
three four inches thick, come sailing
in my direction. Now looking back,

413
00:39:39.159 --> 00:39:45.320
it probably didn't intend to hit me. I fell on my button. It

414
00:39:45.480 --> 00:39:50.679
missed, and I thought it was
aiming at me, and I started high

415
00:39:50.679 --> 00:39:54.400
telling it out of there, and
I turned around in time to see a

416
00:39:54.400 --> 00:40:00.440
big silhouette backing back down the dam
at the pond at the he waited at

417
00:40:00.480 --> 00:40:07.559
this place, and I went back
to my house again. It's only a

418
00:40:07.559 --> 00:40:12.800
half mile away. My buddy who
was staying out there showed up to get

419
00:40:12.840 --> 00:40:16.519
some stuff and he's seened. I
was pretty spooked, and I told him

420
00:40:16.519 --> 00:40:20.440
what happened, and he asked me
if I wanted him to stay, and

421
00:40:20.480 --> 00:40:22.559
I said, nah, you can
go back. You got stuff you gotta

422
00:40:22.599 --> 00:40:29.719
do. I'll be all right.
It wasn't ten fifteen minutes after he left.

423
00:40:30.039 --> 00:40:35.480
I actually was talking to some of
the other researchers when all of a

424
00:40:35.519 --> 00:40:44.840
sudden, my dogs went absolutely berserk. They were they were going nuts,

425
00:40:44.920 --> 00:40:53.079
barking, and then they were gone. The dogs left, and I went

426
00:40:53.119 --> 00:40:57.840
out there and looked around and I
had a rock hit the security light.

427
00:41:00.320 --> 00:41:07.840
Looking back, it dawned on me
that these things had waited. They number

428
00:41:07.840 --> 00:41:12.760
one, they knew exactly where to
find me at because again it's only a

429
00:41:12.800 --> 00:41:21.079
half mile away, so they knew
where my house was. And then they

430
00:41:21.159 --> 00:41:28.280
waited until my buddy left. They
waited for me to be alone. And

431
00:41:29.079 --> 00:41:31.960
I went back in the house.
I was getting all excited. I'm turning

432
00:41:32.000 --> 00:41:36.559
off the lights, and I've got
a night vision scope and I'm running from

433
00:41:36.559 --> 00:41:40.960
window to window looking out, and
the wellhouse is out by the creek,

434
00:41:42.159 --> 00:41:50.400
and there was the pressure switch was
malfunctioning and it was making this loud,

435
00:41:50.480 --> 00:41:53.880
clicking noise, and through the night
vision I see a dark silhouette of what

436
00:41:54.199 --> 00:42:04.760
looks like an ape on All fours
come up and it reaches up and grabs

437
00:42:04.800 --> 00:42:10.840
the door on the well house and
proceeds to pull the door off. And

438
00:42:12.000 --> 00:42:15.719
it was checking out the source of
that noise, because it was a really

439
00:42:15.760 --> 00:42:22.199
loud noise coming from that pressure switch. So I get excited. I'm talking

440
00:42:22.079 --> 00:42:28.199
on the forums, and I do
want to add we had the MBRC had

441
00:42:28.239 --> 00:42:36.239
a team in eastern Oklahoma, up
near Salissaw, and at that same time

442
00:42:36.280 --> 00:42:40.800
I'm talking to them, they're getting
rocks thrown at them. Then over in

443
00:42:40.920 --> 00:42:45.119
Georgia, we had another expedition going
on that night, and the Georgia team

444
00:42:46.639 --> 00:42:52.239
had been roared at and I think
they got a bluff charge. So all

445
00:42:52.320 --> 00:42:59.599
three of this is happening at the
same time, three different locations, and

446
00:43:00.800 --> 00:43:06.800
we were we were talking back and
forth and I'm I've got the night vision.

447
00:43:06.840 --> 00:43:10.599
I'm looking out the window and I
see the little ape looking thing come

448
00:43:10.679 --> 00:43:14.880
back, and then there's a second
one with it. Then all of a

449
00:43:14.880 --> 00:43:22.239
sudden, this huge dark mass follows
them, and that well house is about

450
00:43:22.280 --> 00:43:27.280
eight feet tall and whatever was taller, and I am certain it's probably the

451
00:43:27.360 --> 00:43:32.800
same one that I saw across the
road in two thousand and nine, about

452
00:43:32.840 --> 00:43:39.320
a year later, But this thing
and the people that were at I was

453
00:43:39.360 --> 00:43:45.119
actually talking with the head of the
group, and he heard me go from

454
00:43:45.159 --> 00:43:58.639
excited too terrified in one go,
because this thing was massive. And they

455
00:43:58.679 --> 00:44:04.159
went around there left they and throughout
the night they came back several more times,

456
00:44:05.440 --> 00:44:07.360
and I got the feeling that it
might have been some kind of show

457
00:44:07.400 --> 00:44:13.719
of strength or something. I don't
quote me on it, that's pure speculation

458
00:44:13.800 --> 00:44:17.760
on my part, but I definitely
seemed to have got their interest. And

459
00:44:20.519 --> 00:44:24.320
when the sun was starting to come
up, I hadn't slept. I was

460
00:44:25.039 --> 00:44:30.760
basically two worked up to sleep,
and I sat down on the couch in

461
00:44:30.760 --> 00:44:37.719
the living room, which there's a
door in the kitchen which you can see

462
00:44:37.800 --> 00:44:40.119
from the living room, and I
turned on the TV. I just turned

463
00:44:40.119 --> 00:44:43.639
it on to that background always.
I don't know what, didn't know at

464
00:44:43.639 --> 00:44:49.519
the time I was on. But
you ever have something happened in your brain

465
00:44:49.599 --> 00:44:53.400
takes a snapshot that's permanently etched into
your brain. That's how I know that

466
00:44:53.480 --> 00:45:01.000
Raiders of the Lost Dark was on, because as I'm sitting there, I

467
00:45:01.119 --> 00:45:07.119
glanced see movement out the kitchen window
in the pre dawn hours, and I

468
00:45:07.159 --> 00:45:13.079
looked at the kitchen window, and
a face pops up in the window looking

469
00:45:13.199 --> 00:45:16.719
at me, and I had a
loaded shotgun beside me. Right after the

470
00:45:17.360 --> 00:45:22.519
big one showed up, I proceeded
to load the firearms just in case,

471
00:45:22.800 --> 00:45:25.679
and I looked over at the shotgun, then looked at it, and then

472
00:45:25.719 --> 00:45:35.679
looked back at the shotgun, and
its eyes got about as bigg around as

473
00:45:35.719 --> 00:45:43.920
saucers, and it proceeded to disappear. The following night, I heard all

474
00:45:44.039 --> 00:45:46.360
kinds of howls and stuff coming up
in the hills, and we had another

475
00:45:46.400 --> 00:45:52.880
researcher. He was visiting his dad, and he showed up, and I

476
00:45:52.920 --> 00:46:01.719
think he thought that I was making
the whole thing up and everything. We

477
00:46:01.760 --> 00:46:08.320
went up to the marker area and
we started to come back down, and

478
00:46:08.440 --> 00:46:12.880
I was sitting there thinking that,
Okay, I gotta do something because this

479
00:46:12.920 --> 00:46:16.639
guy thinks I'm full of crap.
So I said, I'll tell you what.

480
00:46:16.679 --> 00:46:20.320
We'll go up and look at the
markers. You can see those for

481
00:46:20.360 --> 00:46:24.960
yourself. And we were went back
up in there and we got met at

482
00:46:24.960 --> 00:46:34.360
the tree line by a dark silhouette
about six seven feet talk actually it was

483
00:46:34.360 --> 00:46:39.880
about seven something because I went back
and measured the next day and it had

484
00:46:39.920 --> 00:46:45.119
red eyeshine, and it proceeded to
duck under a branch and start walking in

485
00:46:45.199 --> 00:46:53.679
our direction. And this wasn't a
bluff charge. These were almost Jason vorheis

486
00:46:53.800 --> 00:47:00.079
Friday of the thirteenth Strides. Needless
to say, we got out of there

487
00:47:00.199 --> 00:47:09.239
real fast. And that researcher,
he'd go on to say that he doesn't

488
00:47:09.239 --> 00:47:14.800
think he's ever went as close to
one as he was that night. But

489
00:47:14.880 --> 00:47:21.719
we got out of there. We
went back down there to the bottoms and

490
00:47:22.039 --> 00:47:28.760
something else of interest. My parents, my mother and to her my stepdad

491
00:47:28.760 --> 00:47:31.960
had showed up because they had snoon. They had talked to me and saw

492
00:47:32.000 --> 00:47:37.719
I was scared. I was about
before and before we had went up there,

493
00:47:39.480 --> 00:47:45.519
Rob had played the Ohio House,
the Famous House, and my dog

494
00:47:45.719 --> 00:47:53.079
started looking around nervously, and my
mother actually pointed out to him that we

495
00:47:53.280 --> 00:48:00.360
heard here that all the time down
there, a little we here's a little

496
00:48:00.400 --> 00:48:07.719
more higher pitch. But yeah,
basically usually late at night or something.

497
00:48:07.920 --> 00:48:10.159
And she thought it was some kind
of alarm somebody put up in a bachelor

498
00:48:10.280 --> 00:48:17.199
or something that would go off on
occasion. I said, that's your mom

499
00:48:17.320 --> 00:48:22.159
saying that, yeah, have you
given them a like an audio recorder to

500
00:48:22.280 --> 00:48:25.079
just be like, hey, mom, just put this out in your property

501
00:48:27.039 --> 00:48:30.760
were they weren't living there at the
time. But I've actually put audio recorders

502
00:48:30.800 --> 00:48:35.320
out and tried to catch it.
I haven't had a whole lot of luck

503
00:48:35.440 --> 00:48:38.599
because you can't really predict it.
In half the time, the batteries will

504
00:48:38.639 --> 00:48:47.159
be dead. And I'm not an
audio guy that account of what happened on

505
00:48:47.320 --> 00:48:55.119
your property. Man, I can't
imagine looking out seeing ape like creature reach

506
00:48:55.280 --> 00:49:01.480
up rip a door off its hinges
in the outbuilding. My goodness, I

507
00:49:01.519 --> 00:49:07.679
don't know how you didn't just leave
right there. That's wild, tim.

508
00:49:07.039 --> 00:49:09.719
There was a lot of weird stuff
that happened over the years. But after

509
00:49:09.719 --> 00:49:17.400
I got the research and that,
the ball started making sense. And yeah,

510
00:49:17.599 --> 00:49:23.639
I still own the old play.
It's starting to get so developed out

511
00:49:23.639 --> 00:49:27.079
in there. I don't think there's
going to be activity out there for much

512
00:49:27.159 --> 00:49:34.320
longer. Sure, that's too bad, that is, that is a shame

513
00:49:34.360 --> 00:49:40.599
when the crazy locals start to get
the suburbs creeping in around it, and

514
00:49:43.119 --> 00:49:47.360
oh boy, that's sad to hear. But man, what a story though,

515
00:49:47.679 --> 00:49:57.199
my goodness, And I do want
to add I documented everything Okay,

516
00:49:57.280 --> 00:50:04.960
I photographed the door, the way
l house, the markers. If I

517
00:50:05.000 --> 00:50:12.480
thought it was possibly connected, I
documented everything is that on that m ABRC

518
00:50:13.320 --> 00:50:17.559
forums then, or it was on
the old forums it got We lost a

519
00:50:17.599 --> 00:50:21.360
lot of that stuff when it got
hacked. That I do have all of

520
00:50:21.360 --> 00:50:28.679
that on my private files. And
so you're still actively researching today. Sounds

521
00:50:28.679 --> 00:50:32.400
like I haven't been for the past
couple of years, but it's that's more

522
00:50:32.519 --> 00:50:39.159
due to the past few years being
what they've been. A very interesting I

523
00:50:39.239 --> 00:50:46.199
had no idea that western Oklahoma had
has so many cool things going on regarding

524
00:50:46.400 --> 00:50:54.199
Bigfoot. Thank you for sharing that
with our listeners. Is that m ABRC

525
00:50:55.039 --> 00:51:00.880
the best place to find out info
about that section of the state. You

526
00:51:00.960 --> 00:51:06.039
think we don't have a lot on
our forums about it, but if you,

527
00:51:07.199 --> 00:51:13.760
I'll talk at the symposiums and whatnot
that we have every year, and

528
00:51:13.800 --> 00:51:16.639
I'm more usually more than happy to
share the information with people that we've got

529
00:51:17.679 --> 00:51:23.280
and it's I consider that part of
the state kind of one of the last

530
00:51:23.360 --> 00:51:30.800
frontiers for research because everybody's been ignoring
it. And to be honest, some

531
00:51:30.880 --> 00:51:36.000
of the best action I've actually gotten
was in the northwest corner of the state,

532
00:51:36.480 --> 00:51:40.360
and I've researched all over the state
at this point. I've been out

533
00:51:40.400 --> 00:51:45.199
of the northeast corner up in the
Ozarks. I've been down to the southeast

534
00:51:45.239 --> 00:51:52.760
corner, in the swamps and in
the Caimucchi Mountains, And I honestly think

535
00:51:52.800 --> 00:51:58.880
that these things catch on really quick
to the fact that the people are there

536
00:51:58.960 --> 00:52:05.840
too for them. And when you
go to places that everybody's ignored, like

537
00:52:06.039 --> 00:52:12.079
the stuff in the western part of
the state, it it's almost like it's

538
00:52:12.079 --> 00:52:25.159
a little easier to get stuff.
And again I want to mention the everybody

539
00:52:25.199 --> 00:52:34.519
talks about Laflour County being really the
hot spot, but there's the population for

540
00:52:34.559 --> 00:52:42.639
that county is forty fifty thousand,
Whereas you can go out to the other

541
00:52:42.719 --> 00:52:45.559
end of the state and you've got
a county within a population of two thousand

542
00:52:46.599 --> 00:52:57.039
that's just as big that can That
tells you exactly the difference in how the

543
00:52:57.119 --> 00:53:00.599
areas are. You just can't see
the towns and the other else's in the

544
00:53:00.639 --> 00:53:07.000
eastern part of the state because of
the trees. That's interesting. But so

545
00:53:07.079 --> 00:53:12.159
you have been you have researched on
the eastern side of the state though.

546
00:53:12.639 --> 00:53:17.679
Oh yeah, I have researched and
all over the pretty much all over Oklahoma

547
00:53:17.760 --> 00:53:23.320
at this point. I have also
researched in Arkansas and Texas. Oh wow,

548
00:53:24.480 --> 00:53:31.599
have you ever been to an area
called McGee Creek. Yeah, I'm

549
00:53:31.599 --> 00:53:37.920
familiar with it. I've actually did
some stuff there for the Oklahoma Academy of

550
00:53:37.960 --> 00:53:44.039
Science when I was working on that, but I haven't researched there. However,

551
00:53:44.079 --> 00:53:49.239
I have you searched at the Boggy
Depot, which is not too far

552
00:53:49.360 --> 00:53:53.880
from there, I think back.
Yeah, I did do a little research

553
00:53:53.920 --> 00:54:00.679
at McGee Creek. I forgot.
So the Boggy Deep that sounds really interesting.

554
00:54:02.000 --> 00:54:07.760
Yeah, it's one of the oldest
there's nothing there now it's a park,

555
00:54:07.559 --> 00:54:10.679
but it used to be one of
the oldest town sites in the state.

556
00:54:15.719 --> 00:54:23.679
And that's an interesting place. The
Boggy Depot or McGee Creek Boggy Depot

557
00:54:25.119 --> 00:54:30.480
just bigfoot related, it's interesting or
in general, it's just a really I

558
00:54:30.519 --> 00:54:36.760
would argue in general, but yeah, there is a history of big foot

559
00:54:36.800 --> 00:54:40.880
activity down there. I've got a
spot I like to go to down near

560
00:54:40.920 --> 00:54:50.000
Antlers. That's been pretty good.
Then, of course I've got a spot

561
00:54:50.000 --> 00:54:53.360
down in McCurtain County. I like
to go to too, and that's one

562
00:54:53.440 --> 00:55:00.679
area that this particular area tends to
have a lot of act ey going on.

563
00:55:00.119 --> 00:55:08.119
Oh yeah, if someone was to
let's say, there's a listener and

564
00:55:08.159 --> 00:55:13.800
they're like, oh, I want
to go big footing in Oklahoma. There

565
00:55:13.840 --> 00:55:19.880
are so many options. It's almost
to the point where it's like you don't

566
00:55:19.880 --> 00:55:25.159
even know where to start. Is
do you recommend west side or the east

567
00:55:25.239 --> 00:55:31.719
side. It's hard to say.
This depends on what you're wanting to do.

568
00:55:31.880 --> 00:55:42.159
I would say if something I've done
that's actually worked out really well for

569
00:55:42.320 --> 00:55:49.840
me is I like to look into
sightings that I call are not from traditional

570
00:55:49.880 --> 00:55:54.960
sources. One of the things I'll
do is I'll comb the paranormal sighting reports,

571
00:55:55.039 --> 00:56:01.280
because I'm not saying Bigfoot's paranormal,
but people with a lot of people,

572
00:56:01.360 --> 00:56:07.079
especially with all these ghost hunting shows, anything weird they see out in

573
00:56:07.079 --> 00:56:10.360
the woods gets called a ghost.
So you can go and somebody will say,

574
00:56:10.559 --> 00:56:17.199
yeah, I saw the ghost of
of the Mountain Man that lived over

575
00:56:17.679 --> 00:56:22.639
near Ada, and they said he's
eight foot tall and harry And you can

576
00:56:22.679 --> 00:56:27.119
go there and start reading the comments
that the people are writing because a lot

577
00:56:27.119 --> 00:56:30.800
of these places let people post comments
about what people have saught. And when

578
00:56:30.840 --> 00:56:37.880
you start reading stuff like yeah,
the ghosts got into my ice box and

579
00:56:37.920 --> 00:56:43.079
stole my ham and then threw rocks
at me and he was covered in a

580
00:56:43.159 --> 00:56:47.280
bear skin and he was seven feet
tall, And you start reading this stuff

581
00:56:49.360 --> 00:56:53.679
over and over, chances are you
that's going to be a good big foot

582
00:56:53.760 --> 00:56:58.679
spot to go to. And I've
I've had a lot of luck finding some

583
00:56:58.760 --> 00:57:06.159
research spots doing that. That's really
good advice. Actually I've never heard that

584
00:57:06.599 --> 00:57:08.840
type of advice, but I like
that. That's I think I might.

585
00:57:09.519 --> 00:57:15.199
I might check that out myself for
my own state. I like that it's

586
00:57:15.239 --> 00:57:20.360
no longer there. But one of
the sites I would actually recommend using there

587
00:57:20.440 --> 00:57:22.719
was a you can use the way
back machine and get onto it. It

588
00:57:22.760 --> 00:57:29.840
was called Strange USA dot com.
Okay, and you just find you one

589
00:57:29.880 --> 00:57:32.920
of those stories about a haunted road
or whatever, and then just start reading

590
00:57:32.960 --> 00:57:37.679
the comments that people will put in
there, and yeah, that can lead

591
00:57:37.719 --> 00:57:45.719
you straight to a really good spot. That is that's a good idea as

592
00:57:45.719 --> 00:57:51.440
well. You mentioned Lafloora County earlier, so I do want to hit have

593
00:57:51.639 --> 00:57:59.000
you ever researched in Lafloora County.
Not much. I've done some research in

594
00:57:59.079 --> 00:58:06.480
Pushmataha. One of my first research
sites was actually about six miles west of

595
00:58:06.519 --> 00:58:14.599
Honaby. I'm off just off wild
Horse Creek, and I don't research there

596
00:58:14.599 --> 00:58:20.519
anymore because they put in a they
put in a dirt track racing course just

597
00:58:20.679 --> 00:58:23.880
across the creek from it. But
that was a place that I was getting

598
00:58:23.920 --> 00:58:30.519
some good stuff from, and I
do want to say that it's interesting.

599
00:58:30.679 --> 00:58:38.400
There's a old legend about a guy
named Lafloor in southeast Oklahoma that supposedly got

600
00:58:38.400 --> 00:58:44.119
into a fist fight with a big
foot in the eighteen thirties. And the

601
00:58:44.280 --> 00:58:49.599
old Lafloor cabin is actually on the
property that I was staying at. Oh

602
00:58:49.639 --> 00:58:54.239
wow, it's still standing. I
actually would camping at. The guy that

603
00:58:54.320 --> 00:59:00.679
owns it moved a the old Honebi
schoolhouse down there and he uses that for

604
00:59:00.760 --> 00:59:05.840
his cabin, but he used the
old one for storage and when I was

605
00:59:05.880 --> 00:59:07.760
out there. Whenever I was out
there, I just pitch a tent in

606
00:59:07.880 --> 00:59:13.039
it. Tall Taylor, you think
there's some truth to that. I think

607
00:59:13.039 --> 00:59:15.559
he might have saw something getting into
his corn. I think that part of

608
00:59:15.599 --> 00:59:22.440
it's probably true, but I'm gonna
say the whole him getting into a fist

609
00:59:22.519 --> 00:59:30.679
fight with a bigfoot is probably an
exaggeration, you know, and again that

610
00:59:30.079 --> 00:59:36.800
you see that in modern day too. I touched on the ghost thing.

611
00:59:37.719 --> 00:59:40.559
I've got a sneaking suspicion. A
lot of what people see out in the

612
00:59:40.559 --> 00:59:46.679
woods, they have preconceived notions,
and when they see something outside of those

613
00:59:46.719 --> 00:59:52.000
notions, their brain tries to fill
in the blanks with whatever they've whatever they're

614
00:59:52.000 --> 00:59:59.519
interested in. There was actually a
case from a gay their Mountain, Arkansas

615
00:59:59.559 --> 01:00:02.800
where you who had two sightings less
than a week apart by two different deer

616
01:00:02.880 --> 01:00:10.239
hunters, and what had happened.
The first deer hunter happened to be really

617
01:00:10.320 --> 01:00:16.000
into aliens, and you know,
he was a big fan, watched all

618
01:00:16.079 --> 01:00:23.880
the ancient alien shows and whatnot.
And he goes out into the woods and

619
01:00:24.239 --> 01:00:30.760
he claims that he saw two gray
aliens that were covered in hair, and

620
01:00:30.800 --> 01:00:35.679
he said he knows are aliens because
he had missing time. The second guy

621
01:00:36.800 --> 01:00:43.280
said, he said, yeah,
I seem too bigfoot And they clearly saw

622
01:00:43.320 --> 01:00:46.360
the same thing. It was just
a week apart, in the same exact

623
01:00:46.400 --> 01:00:51.000
same area. But the first guy
was convinced are aliens, And to be

624
01:00:51.079 --> 01:00:54.960
honest, I don't think he had
missing time. I think he probably fainted.

625
01:00:58.000 --> 01:01:04.000
That's what Hunter is going to admit. He fainted totally. Oh man,

626
01:01:05.440 --> 01:01:10.559
that's wild. Yeah, I think
you might beyond to something there you

627
01:01:10.599 --> 01:01:14.960
had mentioned. Hoh, I'll be
earlier. I just just shot in the

628
01:01:15.119 --> 01:01:21.400
dark. You involved in any way
with the siege events twenty years ago?

629
01:01:22.239 --> 01:01:27.480
No, okay, I was familiar
with the story, but and I had

630
01:01:27.519 --> 01:01:30.760
actually been in the area around the
time of it, but it was not

631
01:01:31.239 --> 01:01:36.599
This is before I was doing bigfoot
research. I was actually going down there

632
01:01:36.719 --> 01:01:44.960
and collecting samples of plants and amphibians
for the college. Oh. That's interesting,

633
01:01:45.000 --> 01:01:49.000
but I'm guessing you'd probably still heard
about it even though you're in a

634
01:01:50.880 --> 01:01:55.239
built at that time, not until
actually after it happened. But yeah,

635
01:01:55.320 --> 01:01:59.519
yeah, but I was doing a
lot of stuff. Every spring, I

636
01:01:59.599 --> 01:02:02.760
go down and spend a couple of
weeks in that area doing the field work.

637
01:02:04.679 --> 01:02:07.559
This is part of my part of
a project I have you going for

638
01:02:07.599 --> 01:02:19.960
the college as I was a lonely
biology student at the time. Jim,

639
01:02:20.000 --> 01:02:23.519
I'll ask you one one more question
before we wrap up, and I really

640
01:02:23.519 --> 01:02:28.280
wanted to thank you for your time
tonight. What do you feel that the

641
01:02:28.400 --> 01:02:36.239
best big Foot evidence to come out
of Oklahoma so far? As well?

642
01:02:36.239 --> 01:02:40.440
That's funny because I just did a
presentation at the last symposium called Oklahoma's best

643
01:02:40.480 --> 01:02:49.199
evidence. Oh and stillwell, yeah, in my opinion, the hair I

644
01:02:49.199 --> 01:02:54.159
would consider the hair sample stuff to
be really interesting, and the North American

645
01:02:54.199 --> 01:03:02.199
would A conservancy's tag seven is also
very triguing. But the one that stands

646
01:03:02.239 --> 01:03:07.280
out for me at the top of
the list. People always say bigfoot evidence

647
01:03:07.360 --> 01:03:13.639
cannot stand up the scientific scrutiny,
But in Oklahoma, there was a piece

648
01:03:13.679 --> 01:03:22.239
of evidence that did the chicken man
handprint from the nineteen seventies. It was

649
01:03:22.239 --> 01:03:27.119
supposed to be over near Alreno.
It actually happened just across the river,

650
01:03:28.000 --> 01:03:34.400
not too far from a place called
Cougar or Cougar, depending on how you

651
01:03:34.440 --> 01:03:42.800
want to announce it. But this
handprint something had been rating this guy's chicken

652
01:03:43.360 --> 01:03:47.039
chicken house and he found a handprint
on it, and he called the cops,

653
01:03:47.079 --> 01:03:52.960
and the cops came out and dusted
it, and they were confused,

654
01:03:53.079 --> 01:03:59.000
so they called wildlife biologists to come
out and look at it, and then

655
01:03:59.000 --> 01:04:04.360
the wildlife biologists contacted the Oklahoma City
Zoo and they sent a primatologist out.

656
01:04:05.239 --> 01:04:12.559
So you've got forensics experts looking at
it, you've got wildlife biologists looking at

657
01:04:12.599 --> 01:04:15.119
it, and then you've got a
primatologist looking at it. And they were

658
01:04:15.239 --> 01:04:25.280
trying to debunk that handprint. They
tried the keyword, tried the official conclusion

659
01:04:25.400 --> 01:04:30.679
they all came up to with was
it belonged to a here for unknown species

660
01:04:30.719 --> 01:04:40.079
of primate. Really yeah, oh
wow, that's the official conclusion on the

661
01:04:40.159 --> 01:04:44.159
chicken man handprint. And of course
they got the name because it was rating

662
01:04:44.239 --> 01:04:49.400
henhouses. But and what was really
interesting is doctor Lawrence Curtis from the Oklahoma

663
01:04:49.440 --> 01:04:57.119
City Zoo was really intrigued by this
because he'd been secretly looking into other reports.

664
01:04:57.920 --> 01:05:04.840
And he said the anatomy on the
hand print was a mix between a

665
01:05:04.920 --> 01:05:10.000
more primitive hand than a humans.
But he said it's very similar to other

666
01:05:10.079 --> 01:05:14.639
prints he had been looking at that
had been found in places like still Water,

667
01:05:15.559 --> 01:05:27.079
still Well, Southeast Oklahoma, Missouri, and he was of the opinion

668
01:05:27.119 --> 01:05:34.360
there might be truly being an unidentified
primate in the region. And like I

669
01:05:34.400 --> 01:05:40.039
said, that was since that's basically
the official stance on what the chicken man

670
01:05:40.159 --> 01:05:46.440
hand print was. The fact that
it remains one of the pieces that actually

671
01:05:46.960 --> 01:05:53.320
took a scientific pounding and came out
on top. Wow, I'm gonna need

672
01:05:53.400 --> 01:06:00.639
to look more into that. That
is awesome. Has that been talked about

673
01:06:00.719 --> 01:06:05.280
in any books that you found?
Oh? Yeah, Lauren Coleman talked has

674
01:06:05.320 --> 01:06:10.199
talked about it. He tries to
use it as the part of the evidence

675
01:06:10.239 --> 01:06:17.000
for his North American a hypothesis.
But you can find pictures of the print

676
01:06:17.079 --> 01:06:23.719
at on the Cryptomundo website. But
you can also look on newspapers dot com

677
01:06:23.760 --> 01:06:29.079
and find information about it. Like
I said, the whole case is very

678
01:06:29.119 --> 01:06:32.760
interesting. The chicken Man flap was
probably one of the biggest cases ever in

679
01:06:32.800 --> 01:06:41.119
Oklahoma. It's right up there with
the Noxy Monster, and in part that's

680
01:06:41.199 --> 01:06:50.800
because of Fate magazine actually did a
special on it. Interesting, very interesting.

681
01:06:50.840 --> 01:06:57.920
I'm gonna have to do a little
digging antet that'll be fun. A

682
01:06:58.119 --> 01:07:05.079
chicken man can man big Foot of
nineteen seventies Oklahoma. That sounds like something

683
01:07:05.159 --> 01:07:09.559
I would like. I like nineteen
seventies big Foot in Iowa, So why

684
01:07:09.599 --> 01:07:17.000
not nineteen seventies Oklahoma Bigfoot. Jim, this has been a fascinating chat about

685
01:07:17.400 --> 01:07:21.599
western Oklahoma and some other parts as
well. Thank you so much for coming

686
01:07:21.639 --> 01:07:28.599
on tonight. That was a pleasure. Before we go, can you share

687
01:07:28.639 --> 01:07:32.000
with the listeners, is there any
way to keep up to date with what

688
01:07:32.039 --> 01:07:35.599
you're doing, or you a guy
in the shadows, or how can they

689
01:07:35.679 --> 01:07:42.039
contact you if they have information about
your area of Oklahoma all that good stuff.

690
01:07:44.440 --> 01:07:48.840
You can probably can contact me on
Facebook barely easily enough. As far

691
01:07:48.960 --> 01:07:56.039
as being a public voice, I
used to be a little bit more proactive,

692
01:07:56.039 --> 01:08:00.199
but I've been trying to avoid the
politics part of it because I to

693
01:08:00.320 --> 01:08:03.559
prefer to be out in the woods
doing the research. That's honestly one of

694
01:08:03.599 --> 01:08:10.679
the reasons I don't do a lot
of talks on podcasts anymore. Yeah,

695
01:08:10.719 --> 01:08:16.359
and again, I'm super thankful for
you agreeing to come on to a big

696
01:08:16.439 --> 01:08:21.520
facade. It's been a great chat. There's plenty of rabbit trails from this

697
01:08:21.560 --> 01:08:30.039
conversation for listeners to start going down
to find some really cool history tidbits to

698
01:08:30.119 --> 01:08:33.079
do with Bigfoot. But Jim,
thank you so much again for coming on

699
01:08:33.199 --> 01:08:38.479
tonight. It was fun. You'd
like to make a special one time donation

700
01:08:38.520 --> 01:08:41.039
to big Foot Society, you can
head on over to the buy me a

701
01:08:41.119 --> 01:08:45.600
Coffee page. I'd like to shout
out Brian Corbyn this week for buying five

702
01:08:45.760 --> 01:08:51.479
coffees which will greatly help with our
upcoming trip to Monster Fest and beautiful can't

703
01:08:51.560 --> 01:08:57.119
Ohio. His message says, can't
wait to hear how monster Fest goes.

704
01:08:57.760 --> 01:09:00.079
I'll be sharing that with the Patreon, of which is also a member.

705
01:09:00.359 --> 01:09:06.199
Rock on, Brian, You're a
great guy. The link for buy me

706
01:09:06.239 --> 01:09:10.680
a Coffee, along with everything else, is in the show notes. Thank

707
01:09:10.720 --> 01:09:15.279
you for listening tonight. Become a
supporting member of the Bigfoot Society podcast by

708
01:09:15.319 --> 01:09:20.760
going to www dot Patreon dot com
forward slash the Bigfoot Society and receive extra

709
01:09:20.800 --> 01:09:28.319
episodes and early at free episodes as
well. If you've got a personal Bigfoot

710
01:09:28.359 --> 01:09:31.600
encounter you would like to submit for
me to share on the podcast, please

711
01:09:31.600 --> 01:09:38.880
head on over to www Dot Bigfoot
Society podcast dot com. There you'll find

712
01:09:38.880 --> 01:09:43.119
the share your big Foot encounter form
a little lower on the page, and

713
01:09:43.319 --> 01:09:47.920
please take a minute to share as
many details as you can. Please state

714
01:09:48.000 --> 01:09:55.920
if the encounter is anonymous or what
name you would like associated with the encounter

715
01:09:56.239 --> 01:10:02.960
and as always thanks for listening.
S